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Flame-Out; engine quits & hard to restart
Topic Started: Jun 9 2010, 07:14 PM (1,032 Views)
geojoe
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Help! . . . for about two weeks now I've had an intermittent problem with my 97 Geo Metro LSI. (4cylinder 1.3 engine). . . while at cruise, at or around 65 to 70 she just flames-out, . . sometimes she'll pick back up again & continue on & then sometimes I'll have to make a "dead-stick" landing on the side of the road, & let her cool off a bit & start up. When this happens, the "Service Engine Soon" light illuminates, & I feel a bit of a faulter in power then she just drops-out. . . . I made four dead-stick landings just today on my way home from work!
I've borrowed my friends code reader & I keep getting EGR Flow codes P0400, so I've been to the wrecking yards & have changed the EGR valve, the solenoid Vacuum Valve, the Vacuum Switching Valve, the Bypass Valve, the MAP sensor, new plugs,wires cap & rotor, the exhaust manifold had a crack in it so I changed that. . . I even changed the ignition coil & distrib pickup thinking it might be that. Other than that, when it's not acting-up, she's runnin' like a watch!
I don't want to take it to a shady mechanic & spend 400.00 on some little gizmo & pay for his overhead. . . . . I'm about ready to get the five gallon gas can & kitchen matches out!

:banghead
Edited by geojoe, Jun 9 2010, 09:03 PM.
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Bad Bent
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Facetious Educated Donkey

I'll start with my favorite web site http://www.obd-codes.com/p0400
Quote:
 
#1 Using a scan tool, operate the EGR valve with the engine running. If the engine stumbles, the problem was likely intermittent wiring problem or intermittent blockage problem
#2 If engine doesn't stumble, operate the EGR valve manually, if possible. If engine doesn't stumble and die, the ports are likely plugged. Removal of valve and cleaning of all ports will be required
#3 Checking of solenoid can only usually be done with a scan tool, because most solenoids operate with a duty cycle of voltage, rather than constant voltage
#4 Check all vacuum lines, hoses, etc for any damage
#5 Visually inspect the solenoid harness and the solenoid for damage
#6 Replace EGR valve


But only #1 & #5 would be intermittent wiring or blockage. The wiring issue might show up if it's running and you gently move the wiring harness you may find a broken or corroded wire that causes the flame out.

Check out this topic: Fuel pump relay. Post #12 has a schematic (1992-1993) that shows a WHT/BLU wire from the Fuel Pump Relay (possible suspect) to the ISC, EGR Solenoid and F1 Relay another possible suspect in the fuse box between the battery and LF fender.

#2 Did you clean the EGR and EGR ports in the block and intake manifold when you replaced the EGR? Have to ask. :smackface I saw a chunk of carbon in the last EGR I cleaned.

Next question would be how old is the Catalytic converter? The test is to see if it runs better with it disconnected at the oil filter - but, I know it runs great, normally, it might run a little better. :dunno
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geojoe
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Thanks Bad-Bent, ... I'm thinking maybe #1 & #5 maybe a good start, I know it's not blockage, I cleaned the heck out of everything when I changed EGR, I used a dental pick, pocket knife & an aircraft compressor shopvac, got lots of carbon chunks out. (it's squeeky clean) . . I'll check wire harnesses tomorrow after I get home from work. I dinked around on it tonight, cleaned & tested EGR modulator, pulled all solenoids off & cleaned them up real good, took her up for a test flight (close to the home field) & it seems worse than ever. maybe there is a loose or broken wire hiding somewhere, . . sounds sensibile. . . either way, I'm done for the day . . parked the geo, shut the garage door, turn off the lights, time for a cold beer & a shower. . . I'll have to drive the truck tomorrow $$$$. :hmm
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crankcase


Very odd symptom and error code, especially at that speed ??
I suppose it could be stuck open, as in full on ???

Maybe disable the EGR (so the valve remains closed)
to see what happens?

Are there any other symptoms or odd things happening?
Edited by crankcase, Jun 10 2010, 01:36 AM.
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Woodie
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geojoe
Jun 9 2010, 07:14 PM

I've borrowed my friends code reader & I keep getting EGR Flow codes P0400, so I've been to the wrecking yards & have changed the EGR valve, the solenoid Vacuum Valve, the Vacuum Switching Valve, the Bypass Valve, the MAP sensor, new plugs,wires cap & rotor, the exhaust manifold had a crack in it so I changed that. . . I even changed the ignition coil & distrib pickup thinking it might be that. Other than that, when it's not acting-up, she's runnin' like a watch!
Ouch! EGR problems are usually clogged passages, not bad parts, and VERY RARELY cause any driveability problems whatsoever. Unplug and cap the vacuum hoses going to your EGR valve and go for a drive, if you still have the problem, then forget EGR as being related to it.
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CityConnection
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Sir, yes sir!

Yeah, I think the EGR problem might just be a coincidence. Do like Woodie suggested and see if we can remove it from the equation.
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geojoe
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K, . . . Did everything I could . . . checked all wires for loose or broken connections, disconected EGR, (still did the "flame-out" thing), . . . I even took apart the throttle body & cleaned the injector, changed a cracked or rolled "O"ring, . . . blew everything out, . . . swapped out a TPS from a dead geo at the junk yard, swapped out an idle speed control motor from the junk yard, . . . still no change. :dunno . . . . sooooooo took the car to Meineke auto center today (I know, I know, what a WUUUSSSY! ! ! ! !) . . . well I'm tired of using up all my PRESIOUS spare time burried under the hood of my geo. . . I'm gonna pay somebody to fix it! you all don't realize how hard it is for me to just say those words. that just goes totally against my grain! . . .But they're gonna call me tomorrow & let me know the verdict. . . . . probably something really stupid like a loose coil wire or something like that, :smackface
More to follow :thumb
Edited by geojoe, Jun 14 2010, 08:16 PM.
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