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| spark..starts to run..then no spark and continues cranking | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Nov 5 2010, 08:00 PM (1,814 Views) | |
| Metro Blake | Nov 5 2010, 08:00 PM Post #1 |
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Metro Lover
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in reference to this thread http://geometroforum.com/topic/3911013/1/?x=90#new got the dizzy replaced... went to start it ... it would spark for the first crank (sometimes not spark at all!) and then lose spark and continue cranking.... causeing the car to start to start but then not run.. i went back to the junkyard and picked up 3 coils.. and 2 of thoses little things with the red plug and mitsubishi logo on them and the little relay thing by coil wire... swaped them all around and still the same results... im lost now and not sure whats up! its a 97 LSi automatic 4cyl.. any help greatly appreacted! (btw im not getting any codes ) |
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| allmountain40 | Nov 5 2010, 08:33 PM Post #2 |
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o.k. looked at other thread. Are you using a new cap? Old one had a lot of copper dust from pics. If you are using that one, it would be arcing all over inside the cap getting no spark to plugs. |
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| Metro Blake | Nov 5 2010, 09:30 PM Post #3 |
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Metro Lover
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using a diffrent cap... its not perfect but ive seen way worse run...and its having the symptoms from the coil wire as for spark so im thinking its something before the coil ... but not sure what is before the coil lol... |
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| mcmancuso | Nov 5 2010, 10:44 PM Post #4 |
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if the car is not getting the correct signal from both the sensor in the distributor and the crank sensor, it will cut spark off. You sure you got a distributor from the right year, a 92-95 dist will NOT work with 96+ and not the other way around either. changed years, model switch was 95-96 not 94-95 year models for the electronics. Edited by mcmancuso, Nov 6 2010, 12:49 PM.
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| mwebb | Nov 5 2010, 11:47 PM Post #5 |
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FOG
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duh , you have violated the TEST- DO NOT GUESS rule pain should be a good teacher , learn your lesson and stop guessing . now . =============================================================== ![]() there is known good CKP and CMP sensor waveforms at start , with spark , note spark does not start until amplitude of CKP and CMP exceeds a value get out your DVOM , while cranking the starter , measure signal output of the CKP (crankshaft position sensor ) and CMP (cam shaft position sensor ) use T pins to connect , search under T pins in the how to section . report test results here for the next instruction if these signals to the ECM are good , the ECM will send an IGT signal . a square wave pattern to the spark amplifier which will then toggle the negative side of the coil to ground and release it to create / cause spark . i will provide a description of how to test those circuits .... IF you get that far and have the need to test them . ready , begin don't have a DVOM ? go buy one , yesterday , stop peeing away your money on ignition coils that you do not need yes i am an arrogant SOB - thank me very much . |
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| Metro Blake | Nov 6 2010, 12:20 AM Post #6 |
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Metro Lover
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i got the dizzy from a 95... yeah i failed hard on buying the coils but it was only $7 and i ended up finding a radio i need for another car while i was there so not a huge waste of time.. lol and the dizzy was definitely needed! i picked up a nice craftsman 8 function multimeter tonight and will test them tomorrow and post results... i just thought if it was bad it would throw a check engine light like it did with the CMP that was in the old dizzy?... |
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| nerys | Nov 6 2010, 12:49 AM Post #7 |
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Grr
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"yes i am an arrogant SOB - thank me very much " you spoil it by saying it. :-) |
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| Woodie | Nov 6 2010, 05:45 AM Post #8 |
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I doubt that will work, 95 was a completely different engine control system. |
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| mcmancuso | Nov 6 2010, 12:47 PM Post #9 |
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Sorry my bad you need a 96+ thats when it switched to OBD2 and when the dist changed as well, 95 is a freak year, new body style, old engine control system. you have a dist that won't work with your system, that's why it isn't working. It probably won't throw a code because its sending a signal, just a wrong signal, the old one wasn't sending anything because it was broken, not wrong.
Edited by mcmancuso, Nov 6 2010, 12:48 PM.
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| Metro Blake | Nov 6 2010, 01:56 PM Post #10 |
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Metro Lover
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u sure its not obd2? it had the plug under the dash =/ .. im not sure if its a 95 or 96.. i just saw the build date was 95... i know my 97 says built in november 96 it was a purple 5speed 4cyl hatch |
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| nerys | Nov 6 2010, 03:22 PM Post #11 |
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Grr
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96 vehicles were built in last half of 95 onward. so yeah its probable a 96 and if it has the "plug" under the dash definitely OBDII |
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| mcmancuso | Nov 6 2010, 05:15 PM Post #12 |
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Is there a "diagnostic" fuse location in the fuse box under the dash? if there is, its an OBD 1, if not its an OBD 2. My 91 has a big plug under the dash by the fuse box, but its for the airbag system, not the OBD. If you have an OBD 2 car you need a dist from a 96+ car, the 95 dist will NOT work. |
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| jellybean | Nov 6 2010, 08:54 PM Post #13 |
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look at your old dizzy does it have a v grove in one of the cam lobes (remove the rotor) does your new one have this ? and do the part #s match?.. i did the same swap and it acted the same as yours. |
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| Metro Blake | Nov 7 2010, 12:32 PM Post #14 |
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Metro Lover
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i will check the for the V grove .. but the little stickers with the part numbers on them are both worn off :(... im hoping it is just the wrong dizzy... i dont want to spend $75 for another dizzy (only 96-97 one i can find is from an dismantler where they pull the parts and chrage ya tripple the price of others..) if the dizzys both have the v groove i should test the crank and cam sensors right? and if one dizzy is diffrent then just go ahead and get the the right dizzy ... not sure but i think if i test the sensors with the wrong dizzy on it may throw the readings off? |
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| Metro Blake | Nov 7 2010, 02:28 PM Post #15 |
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Metro Lover
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ahem. may i have your attention please! THE GEO IS ALIVE!!!!!!! now im off to get atf so it can move
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Sorry my bad you need a 96+ thats when it switched to OBD2 and when the dist changed as well, 95 is a freak year, new body style, old engine control system. you have a dist that won't work with your system, that's why it isn't working. It probably won't throw a code because its sending a signal, just a wrong signal, the old one wasn't sending anything because it was broken, not wrong.
7:19 PM Jul 10