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Help Rebuilding a Tranny in Cleveland, OH; Bad syncros
Topic Started: Feb 18 2011, 05:15 PM (8,570 Views)
cryboytheman
Mr. Cryer
[ *  *  * ]
Well, i decided to go ahead and try dayle1960's suggestion and.......no go, it did not work for me:(

I'm not sure where to go from here, car just wont shift into 1st, 3rd, 5th, or reverse. Could I have something too tight?
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dayle1960
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Fastest Hampster EVER

Cryboytheman, this will NOT fix your problem, what it will do is keep some $$ in your pocket until the tranny is flushed. Do a search on other oils in the slushbox and I'm sure you will find examples of what I'm talking about.

Mr.Murf is the expert on 5 speeds here. Ask specific questions with specific problems and he should get you close to the fix. Don't get frustrated that your replyies aren't answered PDQ because Murf is busy. :thumb
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cryboytheman
Mr. Cryer
[ *  *  * ]
Thanks dayle1960;)
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Murf 59
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I got your PM. Its not an oil problem. Some thing is not assembled right in the trans its self. Check the little cast iron head under the odd shaped triangle cover. Its held down with 3 10mm bolts. Also check that your switches and guide bolts are in the correct holes. If one of the guide bolts were in the wrong spot. It could make shifting it really hard. Those are the bolts with the funny little nipples on the threaded end. And a gentle reminder. Always test shift after a build. I will be tonight - Thurs PM. working nights this week. And since we are all friends here. You can just call me Murf :thumb :lol
Edited by Murf 59, Jul 13 2011, 12:46 AM.
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Murf 59
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I discussed this issue with my supplier today. He agrees, that its gonna be something affecting the main shift rail. It should be a switch with out a crush washer, or one of the stake bolts in the wrong spot or lacking a crush washer too. I hope this helps. I will be in tomorrow PM also. Then out till Mon. Maybe later.
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cryboytheman
Mr. Cryer
[ *  *  * ]
I'm working on troubleshooting today. Here's what I've tried thus far (none have solved my problem):
1st. Loosened all 3 "gear shift fork shaft bolts," one at a time (http://www.teamswift.net/album_pic.php?pic_id=4183)
2nd. Disconnected "gear shift control shaft" http://www.teamswift.net/album_pic.php?pic_id=4160
3rd. Backed out "gear shift interlock bolt" (http://www.teamswift.net/album_pic.php?pic_id=4187)
4th. Removed reverse switch.

When I took off the "gear shift guide case" http://www.teamswift.net/album_pic.php?pic_id=4187, I noticed that the shaft does not have full travel. The vertical travel that I speak of is shown at this link:http://www.teamswift.net/album_pic.php?pic_id=4154

I wonder if i have the "gear shaft arm" installed backwards??? I guess there's only one way to find out. Time to drain the fluid and see if i can check this without taking the transmission back down.
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Jittney
Anchorage 92 XFi

I was wondering about the yoke :dunno
If you have the triangular plate off (down by the drain plug) can you see which way the yoke is angled?
This is the way it should be.
Just trying to rule this one out. :)
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same part from another transmission
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Edited by Jittney, Jul 17 2011, 07:14 PM.
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cryboytheman
Mr. Cryer
[ *  *  * ]
Thx for the post Jittney, the yoke WAS BACKWARDS!!!! I flipped it over and now I can shit into all 5 gears:) Now on to the next problem...
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cryboytheman
Mr. Cryer
[ *  *  * ]
Got'er working!! The yoke, under the triangular plate, was backwards. I flipped it over and now she's on the road.

On to the next to problems:
1. Shifting into 2nd - I have to hold the shifter in position in order for the tranny to stay in gear. If I'm not holding it down, the gears grind and then she drops into place. Keep in mind, if I hold it down hard, then she shifts great (syncros seem to work when doing this). Note,shifting 3,4,5 works fine.

2. Shifting into R - when I go into reverse, getting back to 1st becomes a problem; I have to shift to 4th before I can get'er back into 1st.

Tonight, I adjusted the clutch and loosened all 3 "gear shift fork shaft bolts," one at a time, to see if problem 1/2 would go away, but...NO LUCK.

Any ideas?
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Jittney
Anchorage 92 XFi

Nice work on the yoke :thumb

If first and second are not holding, then either the bolt is not tight (maybe the spring under the bolt is worn out) or the rail is worn, or the slider is worn or the synchro(s) worn.
Synchromesh can heal a bit of a synchro problem.
Double-clutching can be used if the synchros are toast.
The 1/2 rail, slider and synchros are all replaceable....and can be bought separately.
Maybe the pictures below will help visualize what is going on when you try to use first and second.
Somebody correct me if I mislabeled something in a pic.
The slider in the pictures shows definite signs of wear.

When shifting, the gear shift selects which fork (on the right) it wants to move.
The fork moves the rails up and down.... moving the sliders fastened to the rails.
The 3 bolts that you loosened up correlate to the 3 forks on the right.
When you loosen up a bolt, that rail will not stay wedged in place.
If you can shift 3/4 then the middle one is fine.
The shift rails for 5th and Reverse are working fine.
Conclusion....seems like a standard case of 1st and 2nd synchros and slider worn out.

Neutral
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First gear engaged
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Second gear engaged
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Mislabeled 4.10...it's actually a 4.39
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cryboytheman
Mr. Cryer
[ *  *  * ]
One problem...I just replaced all of the syncros...guess that doesnt mean that the slider isn't worn....

BTW, the pix are very helpful
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Jittney
Anchorage 92 XFi

In that case, check the springs under the bolts.
I'm trying to remember the lengths....ok, found the pic of the Swift transmission.
As you can see, they are short, long, short.
You'd be wanting to verify that there is a spring under the first bolt.
Behind the spring should be a small ball bearing....just like the other 2.
I advise using a good magnet to take them out to check them...or they'll go bouncing off and get themselves lost. :)

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ha ha...I see the broken phillip head screws from the end plate.....on the paper.....that was an unfixable transmission, unlike yours. :)
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cryboytheman
Mr. Cryer
[ *  *  * ]
I know they're down in there...are you recommending that I replace them? Maybe the first one to see if it makes a difference...
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Jittney
Anchorage 92 XFi

I'd swap 1 and 3.....the springs, ball bearings and the bolts.
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cryboytheman
Mr. Cryer
[ *  *  * ]
Side note, I think I'm going to randomly upload some pix here...I wasn't sure of how to do this earlier, but since I've tweeted a lot about this project...most of the pix ended up on lockerz:

Look mom, it's all taken apart:)
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Bearings and syncros installed: Posted Image


Make sure you can get this "snapring" back on BEFORE putting this shaft into the tranny. You'll save yourself a big headache Posted Image

OMG, excellent alternative to buying the $129 2ton press from Harbor Freight. I would have bought it if I had the money, but these 3/4 inch rods worked just fine for pressing the gears/bearings back on
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Just incase you're interested/need to make your own torque wrench:Posted Image
Torque Wrench Calculations: http://www.ehow.com/how_5199110_make-own-torque-wrench.html

Thank GOD this bolt came out: Posted Image

This pic is from the very last night that I was with the tranny...she gave me a heck of a time going back in. NOTE, block the engine so that she doesn't move out of position when you remove the tranny....you will be glad you did:
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Here's the pix that I couldn't get off of Facebook:
Workbench i built so that I could have a place to rebuild my tranny - http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.629501721912.2132557.57101584&l=e195a2bf1e&type=1

Random pix - http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.629499072222.2132554.57101584&l=f77dae0002&type=1
Edited by cryboytheman, Jul 20 2011, 01:44 AM.
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