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Any Ideas
Topic Started: Aug 9 2011, 09:35 PM (3,524 Views)
nerys
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Grr

usually the starter engages the FLY WHEEL not the engine.
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t3ragtop
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Turbo3 and Twincam Tweaker

the automatics use what is called a flex plate instead of a true flywheel. the flex plate holds the big ring gear for the starter. the torque converter is bolted to the flex plate and it's mass also acts like a flywheel.

the flex plate is way thinner than a manual's flywheel and because of that it's more prone to cracking.

i think you have a classic case of a cracked and distorted flex plate which is why the starter seems to drag sometimes, lock up sometimes, and accounts for the clunking sound.
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Memphis metro


nerys
Aug 13 2011, 09:59 AM
usually the starter engages the FLY WHEEL not the engine.
In essense the starter is engaging the engine because the flywheel/flexplate is bolted to it. Not the torque converter. So if the converter bolts got loose the starter would still engage the flywheel which is on the engine thus engaging the engine instead of the torque converter.
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JoeBob
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Why you Mutt!

In all of this discussion, there has never been a description of what happens when he hits the starter...does it sound like this:

rawr-rawr-rawr (normal), or

zeeeeeeeeeee (starter not engaging), or

wheeeeeeeee (engine turning with no compression, indicating possible broken teeth on the timing belt), or

whannnnngg (starter almost engaging with flexplate), or

something else.

Knowing what it sounds like when you try to start might help pinpoint the problem.
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nerys
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Grr

hehehe

raw raw raw Zeee Wheeen whannnng
raw raw raw Zeee Wheeen whannnng

sounds like a song :-) hehehe
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maxamy
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[ *  *  *  * ]
JoeBob
Aug 13 2011, 11:31 AM
In all of this discussion, there has never been a description of what happens when he hits the starter...does it sound like this:

rawr-rawr-rawr (normal), or

zeeeeeeeeeee (starter not engaging), or

wheeeeeeeee (engine turning with no compression, indicating possible broken teeth on the timing belt), or

whannnnngg (starter almost engaging with flexplate), or

something else.

Knowing what it sounds like when you try to start might help pinpoint the problem.
The starter is spinning...not sure how to describe the sound but its not real loud,,,kinda normal i guess,,, the motor only turns a little not as many turns as normal...thats why i'm thinking flywheel or something because it don't spin as much as it should....If it was the starter I don't think it would have went out while I was driving would it? I almost stalled then slipped as if the trans was going out....Then I got it home and tried that evening but it wouldn't start....My question is: Is there a way to observe the flywheel (flex plate) while someone cranks it? Is there a sight window or a way to check without removing motor or trans. I would like to just be able to see if the starter is missing teeth or the flex plate has slipped whatever....What would be the best way to check this out?....I really appreciate everyones help...Max
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Memphis metro


Did you have someone crank it while you watched the timing belt? Remove the distributor cap and have someone crank it and see if the rotor spins around while it is cranking. There should be a inspection plate on the transmission under the bottom you can take off and look at the flexplate if you like.
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metroschultz
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Please just call me; "Schultz"

I'm with T3,
Sounds like the flex plate cracked then broke at the hub. Clunking sound before, then again when all h-ll broke loose.
Also check and make sure the starter is mated and bolted tight to the block. If it is just hanging, it will not engage correctly.
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maxamy
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OK I'm pretty sure the flex plate is broke I'm just not sure yet if anything else is broke....Hear is a video I made of me turning the flex plate by hand....I'm pretty sure it's not supposed to do that




I can see the broke part in the middle....Whats the best way to fix this? Remove engine? Remove transmission? or is there a way to replace it without removing either?
Edited by KY Metro, Aug 14 2011, 06:55 PM.
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Memphis metro


No way to replace it without removing one or the other. I would say pull transmission. Glad you found your problem. Hate its a pain to fix for you! Those phillips head bolts you see will have to come out when you start to remove the trans.
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maxamy
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Is this a part that commonly fails? When I get it apart what else should I look for?...I plan to post some pics and video ... This is a pretty big job...I hope I can do it... I assume bell housing bolts, phillips bolts on flex plate, linkage and any trans mounts to remove it...I will update this page with info...Again I really appreciate everyones help...Max
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KY Metro
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Fixed your video for ya. :thumb
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Memphis metro


maxamy
Aug 14 2011, 04:58 PM
Is this a part that commonly fails? When I get it apart what else should I look for?...
No this is not common really. Mostly what fails about flexplates are the teeth and then that is not that common as well. Put a new flexplate in it and you should be good to go. While you have the transmission out it would be a super time to replace your rear main seal on the engine and the front pump seal on the transmission. (might prevent you from having to pull it out again to fix some major leaks later on)
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dayle1960
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Fastest Hampster EVER

enginedoctorgeo
Aug 14 2011, 07:59 PM
maxamy
Aug 14 2011, 04:58 PM
Is this a part that commonly fails? When I get it apart what else should I look for?...
No this is not common really. Mostly what fails about flexplates are the teeth and then that is not that common as well. Put a new flexplate in it and you should be good to go. While you have the transmission out it would be a super time to replace your rear main seal on the engine and the front pump seal on the transmission. (might prevent you from having to pull it out again to fix some major leaks later on)
:+1

Do the rear main seal NOW.....You got a million miles on the rear main seal so it is just a matter of time before it fails. It only about $20, if that much. Drop the tranny. 5-7 bolts, don't forget the small bolt on the black hat that the water tube connects to. Should take about an hour to drop the tranny. It's easy, but then of course i've done mine about four times, so I'm now a confirmed expert on tranny removal.
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91 ragtop
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If it was me doing that job I would pull the engine instead of the tranny. I can get an engine out in a hour and a half and it's easier to get back in to mate up to the tranny than trying to lift that heavy automatic into place. Pm me if you need a flexplate.

Ken.....
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