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All You Stick Drivers Out There!; Question I've been meaning to ask
Topic Started: Jan 23 2012, 08:09 PM (1,379 Views)
Robisaurus
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Cherry popped 01/14/12

I've been driving stick shifts for about 3 years now (my life span of driving :P ), and I never plan to go back. However, I've always pondered a certain question, so maybe you could clear it up for me. In an OVERALL view, which saves money more; popping into neutral and using your brakes to slow you down, or downshifting to slow down? This is an easy question on the basis of fuel economy, but take into account brake wear and tear.
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allmountain40
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As far as fuel is concerned there is no difference in a fuel injected car. As long as your foot is not on the gas, You will only be at an idle whether your in gear or not. Using just the brakes will cause your brakes to wear out sooner, conversely downshifting and riding compression will shorten the life of your transmission. Hard to say which method will cost you more in the long run, but for ease of work, replacing brakes beats replacing the transmission.
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Stiffchezze
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Sir Metrologist

I use both, usually depending on how fast I need to slow down.
But remember, brake pads are cheaper and easier to get to than a clutch disk. ^o)
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Horn


Yea brakes are easier to replace. I dont downshift to slow down unless I have slow down fast....which isnt often
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Johnny Mullet
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Fear the Mullet

I stay in gear until close to stopped. Downshifting is bad for the Metro transmission.
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vr4


Downshifting is supposed to shut down the injectors. I haven't verified this on my swift yet but my old s10 did.
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Good bye


The injector shuts off with the throttle closed above about 2k rpm. So your car will use less fuel slowing down with the tranny in gear under compression. However your car will coast farther in neutral. So the most efficient driving style varies, if you have a long downhill run use engine compression to hold you back. If you are on the flat, shut off the engine and coast in neutral. The later is probably illegal in most states.
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AlexK
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[ *  *  *  * ]
Transmissions are expensive, brakes are super cheap. So I use the brakes unless I'm on a long downhill. The act of downshifting is harder on a transmission than upshifting. If you care here's why:

When you upshift, let's say from 2nd to 3rd, the input shaft of the transmission slows down when you take it out of 2nd and into neutral. It slows because the oil in the transmission causes drag. So when you slip it into 3rd, the input shaft has slowed down to close to the right speed for 3rd gear already. With practice you can shift at just the right speed so make a shift so smooth the synchro doesn't need to do anything and your transmission will last forever.

When you downshift, like from 3rd to 2nd, the input shaft has to speed up to the right speed. The only way it can speed up is by friction from the 2nd gear synchro. A synchro is two pieces of metal that rub together in a cone shape and it's job is to get the input shaft to the right speed before connecting the shaft to the gears. There is oil in there but it still wears out over time.

One way to avoid synchro wear on downshifting is to double-clutch. If you have a worn out transmission with bad synchros that may be the only way you can downshift into 2nd. How to double-clutch: Foot off gas, clutch in, 3rd into neutral. Clutch out, tap gas to rev engine, foot off gas. Clutch in, go into 2nd. What you are doing is speeding up the input shaft using the engine, so it's at the right speed for 2nd gear before you shift into 2nd. It takes practice but it saves wear in the synchros. I do it with every downshift.
Edited by AlexK, Jan 23 2012, 10:02 PM.
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Robisaurus
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Cherry popped 01/14/12

Well, I have come to a verdict; Do the same exact things I'm doing and just hope for the best. I even already have some pads I can replace. Easy Smeasy.
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econoboxer
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I am the one on the left.

Good idea Rob. Also consider that downshifting can cause excessive wear on your sychros. You don't wanna mess those up. The consensus is that pads are cheaper, easier, and many times have a lifetime warranty.
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Coche Blanco
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Troll Certified

The best way to slow down, is to time it so you don't have to. ;)
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Way


I push in the clutch and coast, using brakes to slow down gradually so maybe the light will change before I get there but i do the same at stop signs. I've never actually measured cost or anything but it seems that downshifting raises your rpm which in turn uses more gas. Brake pads are indeed cheaper than clutch pads and easier to work on too.
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Old Man


engine is for GO !! Brakes are for Whoa !! Why question the universe?
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bogs
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Duct tape heals all wounds

Way
Jan 24 2012, 02:13 AM
I push in the clutch and coast, using brakes to slow down gradually so maybe the light will change before I get there but i do the same at stop signs. I've never actually measured cost or anything but it seems that downshifting raises your rpm which in turn uses more gas. Brake pads are indeed cheaper than clutch pads and easier to work on too.
This is actually the worst way to do it, as your putting a.) unnecessary pressure on the clutch cable, arm, and bearing in the tranny when you hold the clutch in and coast, if you are going to coast to a stop in neutral then put the car in neutral and use the brakes to slow yourself.

As for the down-shifting part of the above statement, b.) keeping your rpms up (in this engine) keeps the engine in dfco (deceleration fuel cut off) when your foot is off the gas pedal as your slowing down, so essentially you are using no fuel when stopping as opposed to when you are accelerating and your rpms are up.

You will give your transmission considerably longer life if you learn to double clutch and shift properly in both directions (up and down), however it is still cheaper and easier to replace brakes than tranny parts.
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todaugen


I just changed my front brake pads; it took about 10 minutes per side and cost--I forget already it was so cheap.

I coast to lights and stop signs in neutral for that reason: brakes are cheaper to work on than the tranny and engine.

The only time I downshift is into 2nd gear for cornering, and that's after slowing way down.

I could care less about the injector shut off. This car gets wicked good gas mileage. Worrying about a properly functioning Metro's mpg's is like worrying about being thirsty when the well is full.
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