Welcome to the all new Geo Metro Forum. We hope you enjoy your visit.You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are features you can't use and images you can't see. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free. If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features: Join our community! |
| Cam/Crank seals; getting ready to replace these | |
|---|---|
| Tweet Topic Started: Jul 18 2012, 02:54 AM (5,916 Views) | |
| Bad Bent | Jul 26 2012, 06:41 PM Post #31 |
|
Facetious Educated Donkey
![]()
|
Actually... after my cam seal blew and sent oil everywhere, because the PCV valve and tube were clogged, I left the oil on the frame horn to protect it from water and corrosion.
|
![]() |
|
| 3220onr | Jul 29 2012, 02:44 PM Post #32 |
![]()
|
The timing belt tensioner still has not arrived! While waiting I have been cleaning various things before re-install. Of the many things going thru my mind one has been festering...the crank pulley...is there a specific way to re-install? Or do you just line up the little pulley holes with the crank gear? I also cannot find a timing mark on the pulley. Additionally, I might be nuking the timing thing also. Sounds pretty simple. Line up the rotor to #1, make sure #1 cylinder is at TDC and make sure timing marks on both crank and cam gears are lined up with timing belt installed. Lastly, why does it look like there are two timing marks on the cam gear? USN-DBG |
![]() |
|
| Bad Bent | Jul 29 2012, 04:10 PM Post #33 |
|
Facetious Educated Donkey
![]()
|
The crank pulley is either a 4 or 5 hole pattern with a key slot. Take a look at it. There is only one way it can go on the crank gear. The timing mark is on the circumference of the pulley, the outer edge and will be a small notch. I like to fill the little indented notch with white chalk or white finger nail polish so the timing gun light will make it easier to see. When assembled, if your crank is at TDC #1 then the mark should be visible at 12ish. Note: You can briefly test start the engine to see if runs (Alternator and water pump not working). Timing belt on and crank pulley on. ignition timing close. Without the pulley the timing belt will "walk off" the gears. So I assume that maybe you have rotated the crank and or cam independently of each other? Then click on this thread: http://geometroforum.com/topic/2232748/1/?x=0#post166330 If you simply remove and replace the belt no problem. If it broke or it's a rebuild then yes, you want to have #1 piston at TDC. The distributor rotor should be at the #1 cap post. THEN you rotate the engine twice and you should feel air pressure from the #1 spark plug hole and the marks will realign. There are two marks on the cam gear. They are 2 degrees off. In the picture note the two slots showing from under the bolt holding the cam gear on. This picture below: The crank pulley alignment "notch" on the crank gear is at 12 o'clock, partly covered in red right under the timing mark.
|
![]() |
|
| 3220onr | Jul 30 2012, 03:35 PM Post #34 |
![]()
|
The tensioner came this afternoon!!!! The speedbuggy should be running by tonight. I have a photo but am having trouble posting it. |
![]() |
|
| randyrandy | Jul 30 2012, 11:11 PM Post #35 |
|
Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Replaced the cam and crank seals today at a friend's place along with the PCV valve, distributor o-ring, and valve cover gasket. Drove the 80 miles home, popped the hood at a car wash to wash it down before arriving home, and discovered oil almost pouring out (between a fast drip and a drizzle.) It's high but right in the middle between the cam and crank seals. Peeking behind the timing belt cover (almost dark here now, but with a flashlight) I can't see oil coming out of the cam seal. Is it from the cam seal or something else? What could it be?
Edited by randyrandy, Jul 30 2012, 11:16 PM.
|
![]() |
|
| Memphis metro | Jul 30 2012, 11:34 PM Post #36 |
![]()
|
Removed the cam lately? When replacing the caps that hold the cam down there is a slight break where they mate the head and unless you run a bit of rtv across it, it can leak out the end. |
![]() |
|
| randyrandy | Jul 30 2012, 11:44 PM Post #37 |
|
Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
No, but did pull one of the two way bolt that holds down the cam and the valve cover (the one in the bottom left corner, right above where the leak shows up). We replaced the valve cover gasket. Had the cam exposed and removed and put back in that one bolt. Was that a bad thing? The leak appears behind (engine side) part #12 on this diagram.
|
![]() |
|
| randyrandy | Jul 30 2012, 11:49 PM Post #38 |
|
Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Let me get a pic of the bolt that was pulled. And see if this is what you are referring to as the cam cap. Just a moment. Ok, borrowed a picture of what I think you are referring to. This one bolt was pulled out and then put back in. No RTV was put on it. Should RTV have been put on it before reinstalling it?
Edited by randyrandy, Jul 31 2012, 12:04 AM.
|
![]() |
|
| Deleted User | Jul 31 2012, 03:34 AM Post #39 |
|
Deleted User
|
Leaking engines and transmissions are going to keep your frame horns rust free. One of the best camshaft seals is in the Fel-Pro P/N TCS 45852 "kit". It is not a kit. It is a seal. Install the seal with a very light wipe of Ultra-black RTV around the edge. But wait, there's more . . . The Factory Service Manual calls out application of sealant under the #1 and #3 camshaft bearing caps. I use anaerobic sealant. Notice there is a small channel in the #1 camshaft bearing cap, lower left in this image. This is a vent, and a drain for oil that comes out of the #1 camshaft journal. If this passage is plugged, the only way that the engine is not going to leak from the camshaft seal is if it's not running. Remove the #1 camshaft bearing cap. Completely clean out any old sealant. Apply anaerobic sealant to the bearing cap, and RTV to the seal. Leave the bearing cap slightly loose until the seal is properly positioned, then torque the cap bolts to 8 foot pounds. Also, I have found that most aftermarket valve covers gaskets, including "name brand" valve cover seals are of inferior quality. Most of the time, I reuse the existing valve cover gasket with a little bit of fuel lube. Works good, last a long time. The only valve cover gasket that is worthy is the one marketed by Victor Reinz. http://geometroforum.com/topic/4178329/1/ http://geometroforum.com/topic/4574037/1/
|
|
|
| Memphis metro | Jul 31 2012, 05:41 AM Post #40 |
![]()
|
If you removed your cap then this is likely your problem. Remove both tolts and remove the cap and run a small bead of rtv around the bottom of it and put it back. |
![]() |
|
| randyrandy | Jul 31 2012, 07:50 AM Post #41 |
|
Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Geo Glen and blue rhino, Thanks for the replies. I used the camshaft seal you sent me Glen (georandy), the thicker one for the cam, with RTV around the outside and motor oil on the inside. I used a Victor Reinz valve cover gasket. No, it does not leak when the engine is off, but almost pours when engine is running. (No rust on framehorns, CV axle, alternator, a/c compressor, or any of the linkage )The cap was not removed. Only the bolt circled (pic above) was removed. If I understand this right, the camshaft seal may not be leaking? Then I need to pull the valve cover and take off the #1 camshaft bearing cap. Make sure the channel is clear, clean off any old sealant, and reapply sealant where the picture Glen shows sealant. Or, does the camseal have to be leaking?
Edited by randyrandy, Jul 31 2012, 07:57 AM.
|
![]() |
|
| Deleted User | Jul 31 2012, 10:55 AM Post #42 |
|
Deleted User
|
The camshaft seal may not be leaking, or it may. You did properly labeled the image. (Too many Randys ) There are two reasons a new seal will leak. 1) The little relief passage from the back side of the seal is obstructed, or 2) your oil pressure regulator is stuck in the high pressure position.Make sure that the little spring that belongs inside the seal is properly installed. Also, is your PCV valve functioning properly? I missed a Texas call a couple of times. Is that you? |
|
|
| Deleted User | Jul 31 2012, 11:23 AM Post #43 |
|
Deleted User
|
OK. Got the call from Helter Skelter. Shouldn't be too hard to fix.
|
|
|
| Scoobs | Jul 31 2012, 11:37 AM Post #44 |
|
:D
![]()
|
I use the National seal, #710310, ive had pretty good luck with them, currently i have 5 in the glove box of my xfi, just for storing in case i need them later on. |
![]() |
|
| 3220onr | Jul 31 2012, 12:30 PM Post #45 |
![]()
|
AARRRRGGGHHHHH! Installed the timing tensioner and belt, checked timing marks and they do not look like all the photos posted. I checked to make sure #1 piston is at TDC on the compresion stroke five seperate times. The rotor lined up with the #1 spot as well everytime. Feeling pretty confident that it is correct but still have that lingering doubt. In the photo above there are two alignment(?) marks under the cam gear bolt. Mine only has one. Somebody please tell me I did this right. Then after sitting back and rechecking everything in my mind, I tried to start the car and nothing, not even chimes when the key is inserted into the ignition. ???? First thing I did was charge the battery. After 20 min it showed full charge. still no power. Then check fuse block, 70A fuse is blown.!!! Cant find a 70A fuse anywhere. Will a 60A work? This car is not going to whip me! Somebody help. |
![]() |
|
| 1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous) | |
| Go to Next Page | |
| « Previous Topic · Engine Tech & Diagnostics · Next Topic » |


Welcome to the all new Geo Metro Forum. We hope you enjoy your visit.







![]](http://z3.ifrm.com/static/1/pip_r.png)

Leaking engines and transmissions are going to keep your frame horns rust free.
)
9:40 AM Jul 11