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| Thicker oil seems to have solved oil farts for time being...; What else am I messing up by using different oil? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Sep 18 2012, 11:20 AM (1,030 Views) | |
| cwatkin | Sep 18 2012, 11:20 AM Post #1 |
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I was getting HORRENDOUS oil farts and burning TONS of oil (1 quart/100 miles) with the sythetic 5W20 I put in the car. The past fill of 5W30 was slightly better as for oil farting. I had to stop at a parts store and buy oil just to make it home so I went ahead and got 10W40, hoping this would slow the consumption. After almost 2 quarts were added, I am no longer getting oil farts. I even tried to make them happen and couldn't. I guess the thicker oil is making the rings seal better??? Consumption is also way down. Anyway, I consider this a temporary measure so I can keep driving while I rebuild my other engine correctly. I was wondering what other issues I can expect this to cause and how long it will take for them to show up. I know the lifters are somewhat picky about oil viscosity on these engines and this might lead to premature valve failure. How long should I expect this to work and does anyone have a better "mix" of different oil weights to suggest when/if I change the oil in this before I have the other engine rebuilt? For example, would it be better to rin one quart of 10W30 or 10W40 and the rest 5W30? Either way, I don't plan to run this engine too long but would rather not destroy it either as it does still run and would make a good core for rebuilding in the future. I have some ATV/motorcycle 10W40 here to a bike I don't even own anymore and it is what the second quart in this engine consists of? Anything wrong with running this? Conor |
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| Coche Blanco | Sep 18 2012, 12:07 PM Post #2 |
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Troll Certified
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Run it straight up if it helps. 0w40 would be better though. |
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| 99metro | Sep 18 2012, 01:18 PM Post #3 |
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putt-putt
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Keep it under 55 mph to keep from doing the oil farts, IMHO. Keep the RPMs down so you don't overpressurize the oil pan/sump area. I wouldn't use too thick of oil though. 5w-30 is plenty thick enough. Sounds like you are way overdue for a re-ring job. I re-ringed back in October and now I can do 80 mph (shhhhh) without farting. Before, anything over 55 and I was blowing smoke - and that is a serious understatement! I just re-ring, de-carboned, roto-rootered the EGR, replaced some seals, belts. PS You may want to check the cat converter. Oil tends to detroy them. |
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| mwebb | Sep 18 2012, 11:09 PM Post #4 |
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FOG
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never use 5w20 in any geo metro minimum specification is dexos 1 which is pretty close to 5w30 ACEA A1 B1- A5 B5 one of the things the proper oil does is to reduce (relative to dogshnit oil) formation of carbon deposits in the piston ring lands which helps cause your symptom but i would look closely at the valve guides and valve stem seals as well if you overhaul the engine and use dogshnit oils engine life and cat converter life will be un necessarily shorter than what it could be and dogshnit oil at 3k mile service interval costs more to use the the correct oil at 6k interval so it costs more to prematurely kill your engine and cat converter duh yet there will be a few rocket scientist that will recommend just that .... i am standing beside myself |
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| cwatkin | Sep 19 2012, 06:48 AM Post #5 |
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I guess I will just keep my speed down and use 5W30 until I rebuild. I have been using Dexos 1/ACEA A1/B1/A5/B5 oils for my car so far with the exception of this last 10W40 I put in. I was planning to switch to even better Euro spec oil after this fill but don't know what to think after these last smoke blasts and the excessive oil use. Does anything think that 5W40 may be in order? Does anyone think that switching to the better ACEA oils could slowly clean additional carbon from my rings or should this be completed with all the cleaners like Seafoam, MMO, etc. that I have been using in the oil before changing it? I ran these chemicals for 30 miles or so and left them in overnight before changing. I would add chemicals in town, drive home 12 miles or so, let sit overnight, drive to town and back again the next day and change the oil IMMEDIATELY. I did this 3 times and the oil came out nasty and dirty each time. Some of this may have been dissolved crud while some may be from blowby. I can now see pretty bare metal under the valve cover area with the oil cap off. Is this a good indicator that the working parts of the engine have been well-cleaned or not? I suspect that it is time for a teardown and have a spare engine to rebuild but was wondering if there is anything else I should try before doing this. I will have to go to a larger city to get the better Euro spec oils but have used the Dexos 1 or better oils so far. Is there a very real potential for better oils to solve this over a period of several hundred miles? As for the cat, how do you test these? Is it a flow test? I did keep the pipe and cat from the car I junked as well as the engine and other parts. This engine has a bad valve so I plan to just do a complete rebuild on it but would also consider fixing my current one if there are more possibilities. This has 170k without the best maintenance by the prior owners. Is it likely too late for this motor? Conor |
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| Woodie | Sep 20 2012, 04:00 AM Post #6 |
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170K almost certainly needs a rebuild, no matter what kind of maintenance it has had. Nothing you pour on it or in it is going to replace worn metal. |
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| cwatkin | Sep 21 2012, 09:07 AM Post #7 |
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Yeah, I am pretty much counting on a rebuild but this car has been doing GREAT over the past few days with the mix of oil described above. No oil farts no matter how hard I try... I kept it at 75MPH on long uphills without any smoke at all and really just ran it hard and fast to see if anything would happen. I am not noticing any more oil use on the dipstick since I topped it off the other day. I did put about 1/3 quart of automatic trans fluid in the oil during the topoff as I figure that the detergents in it couldn't help but dissolve crud that might cause stuck rings. Like before, the oil has gotten quite dirty looking rather quickly. I am not sure if this is due to blowby and oil burning or more crap being dissolved in the engine. I am going to run this mix oil oils for another week and see how consumption does. I may switch back to a cheap 5W30 for one change and see what happens, then back to the good stuff if my issues are fixed. I really figure this engine is simply worn out and needs to be rebuilt but what have I got to lose as long as I don't go too crazy with my experimentation? If the issue comes back when I switch back to 5W30, what is my best solution until a rebuild? I am caught between installing a catch can and using a thicker oil. Which is best? This car is running great overall and it is hard to imagine that a rebuild is needed but have tried everything else. Conor |
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| starscream5000 | Sep 21 2012, 09:24 AM Post #8 |
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Got 70 MPG?
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If you use thinner oil and the oil farts continue, then a catch can is probably not going to help much. At the rate you're getting oil farts, a catch can would fill up in one drive. You would have to empty it out every time you drive. That will get old quick. If the oil farts come back after you switch back to thinner oil, then go back to the heavier weight and start preparing yourself for an engine rebuild
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| cwatkin | Sep 21 2012, 10:49 AM Post #9 |
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Pretty much my thoughts. I was blowing out 1 quart per 100 miles so I would need a very large catch can and this would be a major pain. I will run the oil in there a little longer to monitor consumption rates and let the ATF do any cleaning it can over time. I will also do a steam cleaning (dripping water in through brake booster line or similar at fast idle) right before changing to clean the valves off. I am sure all this oil burning hasn't been good for that. This seems to clean valves quite well but leaves a water residue in the oil so is best to do right before a change. Conor |
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| starscream5000 | Sep 21 2012, 04:48 PM Post #10 |
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Got 70 MPG?
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When I steam cleaned I used a spray bottle and sprayed right down the throttle body. It's a little more work, but you can control the amount of water a little better. |
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