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Is there a 6 speed transmission that'll bolt up, and other gearing Q's
Topic Started: Nov 1 2012, 06:47 PM (2,725 Views)
Metro Josh
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Is there a 6 speed transmission that'll bolt up or even crazier question is it even possible to ADD an another gear to an existing transmission?

The above may not be cost effective at all as my primary goal is better mpg, part of my commute is a fair amount of highway at about 65 mph I can't really slow down or I'll be late, so what about new gearing for optimal mpg at 55-65 mpg as it seems the Geo Metro is geared to be better at lower speeds like 45 mph as far as mpg.
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Coche Blanco
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Use the 3.79 gearing.
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Metro Josh
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Coche Blanco
Nov 1 2012, 06:51 PM
Use the 3.79 gearing.
Which models had the 3.79 gearing, and what does mine have? I have a 96' 3 cylinder 5-speed hatchback. How much of an increase would there be?
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clarkdw


There is no 6 speed and to add another gear would be $$$$$$$$$.

Your car came with 4.39. The 3.79 is found in the xfi model and later 4cyl models.

Taller tires will get you most of the way there for gearing without changing the trans.

Because your commute is mostly high speed (for a Metro) highway driving you will be a prime candidate to do some aero mods. The benefits are as much or more than gained by gearing.

The biggest gain of all is easy picking. Get a scangage or ultragage and let it teach you how to conserve fuel.
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Metro Josh
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clarkdw
Nov 1 2012, 07:42 PM
There is no 6 speed and to add another gear would be $$$$$$$$$.

Your car came with 4.39. The 3.79 is found in the xfi model and later 4cyl models.

Taller tires will get you most of the way there for gearing without changing the trans.

Because your commute is mostly high speed (for a Metro) highway driving you will be a prime candidate to do some aero mods. The benefits are as much or more than gained by gearing.

The biggest gain of all is easy picking. Get a scangage or ultragage and let it teach you how to conserve fuel.
Well I didn't know if the bolt pattern of the engine matched other cars (Suzuki's since that's the real base model right?) that had 6-speeds, or if it's even possible to somehow bolt up a 6-speed from any car with some type of modifications to make it work? I'm going to school for Auto Body & Paint so mechanical stuff I only know the basics like maintenance and what I learn from others so bare with me.

What is all needed for the 4.39 to 3.79 swap? What is a fair price?

Yeah I also do a far amount of stop and go once I hit the city in my commute, but yes I've been looking into aero mods so thank you for the suggestion. I already taped up my bumper grille opening. Plan on wheel skirts, and underbody stuff too. Also thanks for the suggestion on the gauges as I just bought an Ultragauge and hopefully will install it soon so I can have it help me.
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mjspiess
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What: 5 Speed Transmission
For: '89-'00 Metro
Donor Car: '89-'01 Metro/Swift
Modification required: Direct bolt-on for '89-'00 Metro transmissions. '89-'94 1.3 SOHC 3.52 Swift transmissions may require a shifter bracket to be fabricated onto the transmission, otherwise, direct bolt-on. In order to keep speedo/odo correct with 145/80/12 tires, must use speedo gear from '89-'94 transmission. In order to keep speedo/odo correct with 155/80/13 tires, must use speedo gear from '95-'00 transmission.
Why: 1.3 SOHC Swift 3.52 = Best highway mpg possible (not reommended for 1.0 engine); XFi/'95-'01 1.3 Metro/Swift 3.79 = 2nd best highway mpg possibe & more readily available/cheaper than 3.52; '89-'94 Metro/Swift DOHC 4.10 = 3rd best highway mpgs; '95-'00 1.0 Metro 4.39 = worst highway mpg, but 10 mpg better than automatics.
How: Manual Trans Removal /Clutch Guide & How to Determine Your Transmission Final Drive Ratio - In the Car or on the Bench

http://geometroforum.com/topic/3946668/1/
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Metro Josh
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mjspiess
Nov 1 2012, 08:46 PM
What: 5 Speed Transmission
For: '89-'00 Metro
Donor Car: '89-'01 Metro/Swift
Modification required: Direct bolt-on for '89-'00 Metro transmissions. '89-'94 1.3 SOHC 3.52 Swift transmissions may require a shifter bracket to be fabricated onto the transmission, otherwise, direct bolt-on. In order to keep speedo/odo correct with 145/80/12 tires, must use speedo gear from '89-'94 transmission. In order to keep speedo/odo correct with 155/80/13 tires, must use speedo gear from '95-'00 transmission.
Why: 1.3 SOHC Swift 3.52 = Best highway mpg possible (not reommended for 1.0 engine); XFi/'95-'01 1.3 Metro/Swift 3.79 = 2nd best highway mpg possibe & more readily available/cheaper than 3.52; '89-'94 Metro/Swift DOHC 4.10 = 3rd best highway mpgs; '95-'00 1.0 Metro 4.39 = worst highway mpg, but 10 mpg better than automatics.
How: Manual Trans Removal /Clutch Guide & How to Determine Your Transmission Final Drive Ratio - In the Car or on the Bench

http://geometroforum.com/topic/3946668/1/
So I have to swap the entire 5-speed transmission to one with 3.52 final gear ratio already, or can I just literally replace in the final gear (differential right?) itself? Which in theory couldn't I do better than the Swift 3.52 and have a new gear machined that is less than 3.52, and swap that gear in?
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patrickbruce
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average teenage gearhead

its better to just get the whole tranny, and probably easier too
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Good bye


You really want a 3.79 ratio trans for your car, the 3.5 will be too tall for your heavy car and only 3 cylinders. We really do know what we are talking about. 95+ 4 cylinder car is the tranny donor car you are looking for. Xfis are getting hard to find, but they have the same final drive ratio. :cheers
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Coche Blanco
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Metro Josh
Nov 1 2012, 10:08 PM
mjspiess
Nov 1 2012, 08:46 PM
What: 5 Speed Transmission
For: '89-'00 Metro
Donor Car: '89-'01 Metro/Swift
Modification required: Direct bolt-on for '89-'00 Metro transmissions. '89-'94 1.3 SOHC 3.52 Swift transmissions may require a shifter bracket to be fabricated onto the transmission, otherwise, direct bolt-on. In order to keep speedo/odo correct with 145/80/12 tires, must use speedo gear from '89-'94 transmission. In order to keep speedo/odo correct with 155/80/13 tires, must use speedo gear from '95-'00 transmission.
Why: 1.3 SOHC Swift 3.52 = Best highway mpg possible (not reommended for 1.0 engine); XFi/'95-'01 1.3 Metro/Swift 3.79 = 2nd best highway mpg possibe & more readily available/cheaper than 3.52; '89-'94 Metro/Swift DOHC 4.10 = 3rd best highway mpgs; '95-'00 1.0 Metro 4.39 = worst highway mpg, but 10 mpg better than automatics.
How: Manual Trans Removal /Clutch Guide & How to Determine Your Transmission Final Drive Ratio - In the Car or on the Bench

http://geometroforum.com/topic/3946668/1/
So I have to swap the entire 5-speed transmission to one with 3.52 final gear ratio already, or can I just literally replace in the final gear (differential right?) itself? Which in theory couldn't I do better than the Swift 3.52 and have a new gear machined that is less than 3.52, and swap that gear in?
You can have a 1:1 transmission machined, if you want.
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Woodie
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Taller (lower numbers) gears will increase your mileage on the highway, but rob you of power and require you to use more gas/clutch in town. Your car is already underpowered, and there is a law of diminishing returns. There is no way for us to predict how much you will like a certain modification in your driving conditions with your engine condition. Your car came with the worst transmission for mileage, because they knew that the three cylinder was not really up to the task of the newer, heavier car. When they put the 3.79 gears into the older, smaller and lighter car to create the XFI, they changed the camshaft in order to give the engine more bottom end torque so that it could cope with the high gear ratio. That was with 12" tires. You've got 13" tires, so you're already talking about a bigger change than that, plus a worn engine.

3.79 4.39 95-00 3 cylinders and convertibles Oops, my mistake. thanks for the correction clarkdw
4.10 89-94 base and LSI models
3.79 95-01 4 cylinders and XFI models
3.52 89-94 four cylinders - a rare bird indeed

The differential gears that we are talking about here are integral to the transmission, one of them is part of the shaft which mounts half of the gears, replacing them involves a 100% disassembly of the transmission, you're better off getting a whole tranny.

For that matter, you're better off getting a better alarm clock so you're not always late.
Edited by Woodie, Nov 3 2012, 04:30 AM.
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clarkdw


Woodie
Nov 2 2012, 04:33 AM
Taller (lower numbers) gears will increase your mileage on the highway, but rob you of power and require you to use more gas/clutch in town. Your car is already underpowered, and there is a law of diminishing returns. There is no way for us to predict how much you will like a certain modification in your driving conditions with your engine condition. Your car came with the worst transmission for mileage, because they knew that the three cylinder was not really up to the task of the newer, heavier car. When they put the 3.79 gears into the older, smaller and lighter car to create the XFI, they changed the camshaft in order to give the engine more bottom end torque so that it could cope with the high gear ratio. That was with 12" tires. You've got 13" tires, so you're already talking about a bigger change than that, plus a worn engine.


3.79 4.39 95-00 3 cylinders and convertibles
4.10 89-94 base and LSI models
3.79 95-01 4 cylinders and XFI models
3.52 89-94 four cylinders - a rare bird indeed

The differential gears that we are talking about here are integral to the transmission, one of them is part of the shaft which mounts half of the gears, replacing them involves a 100% disassembly of the transmission, you're better off getting a whole tranny.

For that matter, you're better off getting a better alarm clock so you're not always late.
:gp

One small correction.
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starscream5000
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Got 70 MPG?

Nice catch, Clark. I was about to point that out as well :)
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Bjetmech
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I have been reading a bunch of these topics lately because this is my next area to try to imrove on in my own car. The question I have seen answered is yes the 3.52 tranny is a bit much for our 3 cyl engines to handle without killing fuel economy. But how much? The thought I had was that what kind of performance improvements that we could do to our 3 cyl motors to make it worth while to run a 3.52. Say a 3tech performance head with headers? Would I have to go all out to get the power to drive and just destroy any thought of economy. Or could it be possible to do some things like maybe get around a 10-15 horsepower gain and everything would be fine. Yes 10-15 is a lot for our motors. Just trying to put the discussion out there.
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Coche Blanco
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Run the 3.79. You're trying too hard.
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