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| Billowing white smoke out tailpipe | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 8 2013, 05:22 AM (17,717 Views) | |
| 1DCGUY | Oct 13 2013, 09:50 AM Post #31 |
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Don't be a "Richard"
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Link doesn't work for me either. Repost it, I would like to see the vid.
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| omniminded | Oct 13 2013, 11:05 AM Post #32 |
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First a working video link...![]() or http://gorillavid.in/1i80sptx2fln Last night I finally got to bring the car back to my mechanic friend. The smoke out the tailpipe was white. No blue at all. The exhaust has NO oil smell at all. The oil level on the dipstick is good, but the coolant in the radiator was a little low. The owner that rebuilt the engine (DIY except for the machine shop stuff) had done some shoddy work by reusing other gaskets which have already been replaced. My mechanic friend took a much closer look at the head gasket seam, and at the exhaust manifold seam. My friend said they looked "dry" and made an educated guess that the DIY owner had reused both gaskets. He also suspects the head bolts were reused. I still do not yet have a compression test done. I have not tried sphenicie's "fart collector" yet, and am not sure about where all the connection points go. I also do not know if the oil restrictor was put back in or replaced when the rebuild was done (prior owner, not the seller I bought it from). I have no way of asking. I tried checking the radiator hose pressurization from a cold start, but I just don't know what its supposed to feel like. I did not think to have my friend look when I was there. If the low coolant is the culprit, I'll say that given the clouds created, I'm surprised I didn't loose more than I did and am surprised it took as long to loose the small amount missing. It took very little to refill. Maybe less than 8 ounces. While I was looking at the coolant, I noticed that I could not find a return from the overflow resevoiur back to the radiator. I thought there was supposed to be a return line --? Sorry it took so long to provide feedback. So, thoughts? Edited by omniminded, Oct 13 2013, 11:15 AM.
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| Old Man | Oct 13 2013, 11:34 AM Post #33 |
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If it was mine I would do a head gasket change first. At the same time you can replace the headbolts and replace the exhaust and intake gaskets, and check on the oil restrictor. That seems to me to be the simplest thing that would cover ALL of the bad conditions that would/could cause "white smoke" Re: single hose from radiator to the overflow tank is normal. -- Hot radiator=flow to the tank--cold radiator=suction back to radiator. |
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| omniminded | Oct 13 2013, 12:12 PM Post #34 |
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Okay, wonderful. Then it's settled and I can begin planning those repairs. It's also been pointed out that having the head open will provide the opportunity to look at other stuff like the valves. Plus I know the pistons are gummed up pretty badly so perhaps it would then become possible to clean those? Hmmm... come to think of it, since the piston rings have been mentioned as another possible problem, I guess those could be looked at as well. And then I guess that means it would be a good idea to do a compression test before hand, wouldn't it? So if I'm doing those, would there be any benefit to trying a "fart collector" to see if there might be any oil? It seems like that might reveal even a very minor leak. Even if the head gasket replacement work fixes all the problems, it seems like it would be good to know if there were any minor oil leak. Of course, I don't know what the fart collector is connected to... so... umm... ? Oh! So there IS a return! Then it was WAY lower on coolant after all. The reservoir was almost completely empty. I need to go fill it. |
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| Old Man | Oct 13 2013, 12:24 PM Post #35 |
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Yes -- do a compression check first.-- Careful when filling the water tank. It will surprise you how low the "full" mark is. When all is cold my tank is only about 1/4 full when "full" |
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| sphenicie | Oct 14 2013, 06:43 AM Post #36 |
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first, Omni, I will send you my collector. I will pay the shipping to you if you send it back. otherwise, to build one, you need to use a large plastic jar, about 32oz. then drill three holes, 2 @ 11/16" and one @1/2". run one hose from the breather port(valve cover) thru the cover of the jar and to about 1 1/2" up from the bottom. the next hose run from the jar to the air cleaner. keep this hose at the very top of the jar, about 1' into the jar. then run the third from the PVC nipple into the jar. keep this one near the top like the 2nd. use gasket maker to seal the hoses where they go into the jar, and let set up over night. Basicly, you are replacing the "Y-tube" of the PCV system. the jar allows the liquid to enter the jar and be deposited at the bottom, while the crankcase gas can still exit the PCV thru the top. note; the hole size should match your hose size. next, check the compression and warm idle vacuum. is your throttle body oily on the inside? PCV? I question the idea of "blow by", defined as cylinder compression getting past the rings, for a number of reasons; 1) my "Booger" is running 120/120/120 compression and 21 iom vac, no oil farts. I have had 20+ metros, since my first which was a factory new 1991 I got in the fall of 90. NONE, NONE have had this problem. 2) my builder has built 2 G10's for me previously, no farts. 3) the PCV system is doing it's job, suckn crankcase gasses from the crankcase out thru the breather port on the top of the valve cover, thru the air cleaner and PCV valve. Edited by sphenicie, Oct 14 2013, 06:44 AM.
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| sphenicie | Oct 14 2013, 07:04 AM Post #37 |
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I pulled the head yesterday. check valve is in place, properly installed("screw driver slot" UP). the gasket looked fine. although the holes on the intake side were some what malaligned on the front port. also they were small. this gasket overlaid another perfectly. the other, no farts. there was nothing I could see that gave me reason to question. Snowfish has my pics. if anyone wants to see a particular shot, we can do that. I am taking the head to my builder today. just too see what input he has. I am also bringing another bare head along. I want to get it started right away. I need to have a fresh head on hand anyway. Omni, if you want to run an 'oil pressure' check on yours, I would appreciate it. I am intending to install full gauges, but need to order them yet. it is unlikely, but, maybe there is an aftermarket oil pump out there that is just way to high pressure or volume. I can see right down to the oil pan thru both the upper ports (intake side) and lower ports (exhaust). I blew out the ports in the head, nothing came thru. got to go.....to the shop and let the builder see what's up. i'll be back with any news I get. PS; I am trying to only change one variable at a time, so as to isolate the true issue. Edited by sphenicie, Oct 14 2013, 07:07 AM.
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| Clown Car | Oct 18 2013, 08:49 PM Post #38 |
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New Member
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If the smoke is white and you can smell pancake/maple syrup odor thats antifreeze burning during combustion. Doesn't take much to do that either, a pinhole leak into one cylinder is enough. Watch your oil and coolant levels closely so you don't hurt the motor. If you or someone you know can read spark plugs have a look at them ? Plug color/texture is the real story of what goes on inside a gas engine. If you have it idling in park/neutral with the parking brake on, hood open, quickly open the throttle wide open/floor it with yourself or someone watching the coolant overflow tank. If it has a descent head gasket issue this will open the radiator cap and push coolant into the tank. Make sure there isn't any way for anyone to get sprayed with hot antifreeze though ! The hose from the radiator cap neck has to be connected to the overflow tank and it's overflow hose in place pointed at the ground below the front bumper. My G-10 head gasket leaked and this is how I figured it was the gasket. Mine never made any smoke out the tailpipe though ? No SES light either ? |
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| truckjohn | Oct 19 2013, 09:10 PM Post #39 |
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You can blow a head gasket and not get any smoke out the tail pipe if your radiator cap is junk and the bottom springloaded piece isn't sealing - it won't ever pressurize the system.. and you get exhaust blowing into the radiator and out the coolant tank... On the Previous owner's "Rebuild" - if all the gaskets were re-used... and a *WHOLE* gasket set is under $100.00..... then what else did that fine fellow try to salvage or re-use that was otherwise dead/worn out? If you are up for the adventure - may as well do it right... Thanks |
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| omniminded | Oct 21 2013, 06:16 AM Post #40 |
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I topped off the coolant reservoir while the engine was hot and I think that got it back to the correct level. It's been over a week since having any "Billowing smoke". It has me wondering if the repairs I'd already done fixed the issue and that it will only expelling remnants. I need to check the coolant level again to see if there has been more loss. Either way, I'll still do the head gasket repair as the current one is in bad shape. I've been pm'ing with sphencie and he is going to be sending me his oil collector. I want to know if that is an issue even if only minor, and even if the head gasket repair will fix it.I am assuming that is different than a compression test. I will need to ask my mechanic friend about that. |
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| omniminded | Oct 21 2013, 06:28 AM Post #41 |
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There was no syrup smell. It didn't really smell like anything to me. Just warm air. I will. Even for awhile after I've done the head gasket repair. I recently replaced the plugs (and harness), they're brand new. Would that help or hinder "reading" the plugs? I will try this the next time I am able to visit my mechanic friend. I will also ask him if he is any good at "reading" plugs. No, there's been no engine check light/SES (Service Engine Soon) light. |
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| omniminded | Oct 21 2013, 06:31 AM Post #42 |
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My thoughts exactly. |
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| don_dowdy | Oct 21 2013, 03:15 PM Post #43 |
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Just out curiosity, is the car a 5-speed or automatic? In the good old days, white smoke was sometimes burning automatic transmission fluid, but I don't think a Metro has that type of modulator valve on the transmission. Never hurts to check the fluid level, though.
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| omniminded | Oct 21 2013, 03:45 PM Post #44 |
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5-speed |
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| sphenicie | Oct 23 2013, 07:25 AM Post #45 |
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the "fart collector" is on its way down south. sent it out yesterday. |
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