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Billowing white smoke out tailpipe
Topic Started: Oct 8 2013, 05:22 AM (17,716 Views)
omniminded


UPDATE

I've been driving it for about 2 weeks without any smoke. Then last night it happened again. It was dark and raining so I could not say if it was white or if it had a blue tint to it.


...BUT, I pulled into the closest Walmart and checked my coolant level and oil dipstick. The coolant level was great... the oil on the dipstick did not even go up to the bottom dot. I added between 2.5 and 3 quarts of oil. Eeek!

Continuing my drive, I had more light colored smoke, but then I had a scare: A large puff of dark smoke. It was only the one puff, but has me worried. Even without the collector that Spencie mailed me, this certainly confirms that I am loosing oil.

I'm still about 2 weeks away from having the money to do the head gasket repairs. Now I know I will need to watch my oil level like a hawk. I will keep a roll of paper towels (oil wipe) and fresh oil in the car at all times so I can add oil as needed.

Does anyone have any other precautionary suggestions to make to stay on top of this until I have the rest of the money to make the head gasket repairs?

Now that there is the oil loss confirmation, and now that I had the one solitary big puff of dark smoke, do these suggest any other repairs beyond head gasket?
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Woodie
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More likely rings or a broken piston. I don't see how the head gasket could cause this.
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Airsmithy


I had huge clouds of billowing smoke behind my Geo when I first got it when I drove freeway speeds. Seemed very white to me. I was not loosing coolant, but was loosing oil. When I broke the motor down, there were huge carbon deposits on the top of my pistons and my intake valves. When the previous owner rebuilt the head, he did not replace the valve seals. I replaced those seals in my rebuild (along with adding stainless steel intake valves), put on a new head gasket, and haven't noticed the huge billowing clouds of smoke in 15,000 miles. If your head is still off, check the intake valves. Good luck!
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truckjohn


So... Let's circle back around here....

Do you have diagnostics indicating a blown head gasket?
Say:
Compression on 2-adjacent cylinders very low/zero?
Blowing exhaust out the radiator?
Loosing coolant but no coolant leaks out of the car?
Water in the oil?
White, billowy steam/smoke coming out the tail pipe?

It sounds like "No"...

whereas we definitely have evidence of Oil loss.....

Unless you just want to pull the head for a look-see... I would go after the issue of the oil loss first....
I would get Sphencie's "Oil fart collector" installed - and see if you can account for that oil.... If yes - then I would take a look at the valve seals, camshaft, and perhaps the oil check valve in the block...

Thanks
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omniminded


Woodie
Nov 7 2013, 05:25 AM
More likely rings or a broken piston. I don't see how the head gasket could cause this.
My mechanic friend had mentioned suspecting the rings at one point early on. How would a broken piston be diagnosed?

Airsmithy
Nov 7 2013, 01:37 PM
I had huge clouds of billowing smoke behind my Geo when I first got it when I drove freeway speeds. Seemed very white to me. I was not loosing coolant, but was loosing oil. When I broke the motor down, there were huge carbon deposits on the top of my pistons and my intake valves. When the previous owner rebuilt the head, he did not replace the valve seals. I replaced those seals in my rebuild (along with adding stainless steel intake valves), put on a new head gasket, and haven't noticed the huge billowing clouds of smoke in 15,000 miles. If your head is still off, check the intake valves. Good luck!
I don't know about the intake valves, but yes, my piston heads were all gummed up. I don't know about the intake valves, but I will check those too. The guy that did the rebuild on mine clearly skimped and took shortcuts too.

truckjohn
Nov 7 2013, 01:47 PM
So... Let's circle back around here....

Do you have diagnostics indicating a blown head gasket?
Say:
Compression on 2-adjacent cylinders very low/zero?
Blowing exhaust out the radiator?
Loosing coolant but no coolant leaks out of the car?
Water in the oil?
White, billowy steam/smoke coming out the tail pipe?

It sounds like "No"...

whereas we definitely have evidence of Oil loss.....

Unless you just want to pull the head for a look-see... I would go after the issue of the oil loss first....
I would get Sphencie's "Oil fart collector" installed - and see if you can account for that oil.... If yes - then I would take a look at the valve seals, camshaft, and perhaps the oil check valve in the block...

Thanks
I just finally got the front tires replaced. Not only were they nearly bald, but apparently had dry rot as well. I rotated the new tires to the back. The back tires still had pretty good tread. I also discovered that one of my rims is warped and will need replacing. It's now on the driver's side rear. It's been raining a lot and those tires were a real safety concern, plus I had already paid for the tires and was just needing to get them installed.

I mention that because it is where my money went. I was hoping to be further along toward having the money for other repairs but am saving up and investing in what the Geo needs as fast as I can afford to.

I will get the tests done as soon as I can afford to and report back. Then hopefully that will indicate if I should do one repair before another.

I am glad that I asked about this. The feedback was definately useful. I was uncertain at the time of posting the update if I would be told anything different or not.

And yes, I will get the collector installed as soon as I can get back together with my mechanic friend as I won't know what is what or what goes where.

Edited by omniminded, Nov 7 2013, 08:49 PM.
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omniminded


Okay, real time update. At the place of my mechanic friend, he has done compression tests here are the numbers:
warm dry: 160/170/165
warm wet: 240/260/210

Also the spark plugs on cylinders 1 and 2 carbon buildup while the spark plug on cylinder 3 was "dark without buildup".

My mechanic friend thinks it needs new rings, needs the valve seats checked (possible valve job?), and head gasket job... and a 2nd new pcv valve (still getting oil into the air filter).
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Deleted User
Deleted User

Thanks for the update.

Your mechanic friend is correct.

However, once you get into repairing the engine, I'm sure you'll find more than rings, valve seats, and a head gasket are going to be required.
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Woodie
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You need a rebuild and your mechanic needs a new compression gauge. 260 psi? I suspect that all those numbers are artificially high.
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omniminded


Woodie
Nov 14 2013, 06:19 AM
You need a rebuild and your mechanic needs a new compression gauge. 260 psi? I suspect that all those numbers are artificially high.


Yes, rebuild is what he said. The Compression gauge was brand new first use, bought so we could do the test (from Harbor Freight). We were equally shocked by it jumping so high on the wet tests.
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geogonfa
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IMHO...I haven't found a Harbor Freight compression gauge that has worked right yet...even the expensive one.
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truckjohn


Pistons caked with 1/4" of carbon on top of them ;)
If it doesn't ping like crazy when driving... likely it's not that...
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omniminded


I bought this Geo for 1 reason: High MPGs

So far my average has been 33.2 and my best has been 37.5 as charted by Fuelly. If I am going to need to do an engine rebuild on a car that I bought in the first place because it supposedly had a recent rebuild, then it seems I might as well explore the possibility of doing what I can to raise my MPGs. I know there are folks here that see 50MPG, 70MPG, and I've seen some reported above even that.

What do I need to do to this thing to see a consistent 50MPG and above? And can I do it without breaking the bank? (Mods, if this post needs to be branched into a new thread inside the Fuel Economy section, please go ahead and do so.)
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Memphis metro


Air the tires up and lighten the car and learn high mpg driving habits (foot off the gas) and read your FSM. Well everything except the FSM, thats for Glenn. :lol
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snowfish
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Basic GearHead

Quote:
 
What do I need to do to this thing to see a consistent 50MPG and above?

What Blue Rhino said and drive longer distances. :tumbleweed If you drive 10 miles, or less one way, hitting your goal will be a bit harder. :drivin
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clarkdw


snowfish
Nov 14 2013, 03:49 PM
Quote:
 
What do I need to do to this thing to see a consistent 50MPG and above?

What Blue Rhino said and drive longer distances. :tumbleweed If you drive 10 miles, or less one way, hitting your goal will be a bit harder. very,very difficult. :drivin
FTFY :D

There is no "magic bullet". What the other posters said is true. Learning to drive economically is the first order of the day. Ecomodder. com has all kinds of info on planning routes, etc. Littlest Hobo, my 94 hatch has a lifetime average of a little over 50 mpg U.S. and in the warm weather often has tank averages well above 60 mpg U.S. That is with a completely original engine with over 150k miles. The only change to the engine is a 3Tech econo cam.

Where does the great mileage come from?
1. I got a vacuum gauge and an MPGuino and used them to learn how to drive.
2. Aero mods. My commute is 66 miles one way and mostly highway. I added an airdam, grill block, passenger mirror delete and lowered the car. These mods would be mostly wasted on a city commuter car.
3. Pay attention to the mechanics of the car. Brakes not dragging, alignment correct, no soft tires (I run mine at 50 psi), always pay attention to oil change schedules on the engine and transmission.

If you start looking for engine mods or builds that will make the car give great mileage you will be very disappointed in the end. All the "special engine tricks" will gain you a few mpg. Paying attention to the basics like driving and basic maintenance will get you from 33 mpg to well over 50 mpg.
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