Welcome to the all new Geo Metro Forum. We hope you enjoy your visit.You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are features you can't use and images you can't see. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free. If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features: Join our community! |
| Billowing white smoke out tailpipe | |
|---|---|
| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 8 2013, 05:22 AM (17,715 Views) | |
| sphenicie | Nov 15 2013, 07:17 AM Post #61 |
![]()
|
Omni, if I where you, at this point, knowing that the "recent rebuild" was not done properly, it may be MUCH cheaper for you to find a good strong engine to swap in. then look forward to some mods. there are real nice engines out there for a couple hundred. the cost of a swap would be a wash, since you would be pulling the old engine anyway. |
![]() |
|
| what1next | Nov 16 2013, 02:26 PM Post #62 |
![]()
New Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Skip this reply.
Edited by what1next, Nov 16 2013, 03:19 PM.
|
![]() |
|
| omniminded | Nov 17 2013, 04:56 PM Post #63 |
![]()
|
Sphenicie, this sounds like an excellent suggestion. I don't yet have a full parts list from my mechanic friend, but I have a hunch, your suggestion of an engine swap could prove to be the less expensive option -- by how much is the question now lingering in my head. I would be concerned that the swapped engine was actually good. How would I know, and how would I go about finding "A good strong engine"? And when you say "couple of hundred", do you literally mean $200'ish? |
![]() |
|
| sphenicie | Nov 18 2013, 08:51 PM Post #64 |
![]()
|
yes, if you can not find one in your area, I can certainly help you with that. but there would be the cost of shipping. I just discovered a ' honey hole' of parts, I need to find out about prices, but? otherwise I have 4 on the shelf, I may part with one. stay in touch, and let me know what you are thinking. I will gather some prices for you. steve |
![]() |
|
| ryanbrown | Nov 20 2013, 11:21 AM Post #65 |
|
New Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Omni, I live near poplar bluff, mo and am currently in the process of rebuilding my g10. I also am about purchase a good running g10. If I don't use it in my car, I would sell it to you for what I am giving for it. I will know if I'm going to use it by Saturday. I just started the teardown of mine and do not know what all im going to have to invest, if it is alot ill be using the running motor. Edited by ryanbrown, Nov 20 2013, 06:56 PM.
|
![]() |
|
| omniminded | Dec 9 2013, 02:19 AM Post #66 |
![]()
|
I must first get my Geo on the road again after a Broken shifter. That is still in need of a part. A forum member offered his, and Clark pointed out that I can get one brand new from Japan (or United Arab Emirates aka UAE for less money but longer to ship). Still waiting on the Japanese source to process my request so I am still 2 weeks off from having the part. I paid Geo Glenn for an oil check valve, not sure right now what is happening there as I am still awaiting a pm response or for the part to arrive in the mail. I don't know if I need it, but figured it was better to have on hand already in case I do. Presently, the Pick N Pull situation is pretty bleak. My visit there did not exactly inspire confidence in me using them as a source for an engine. Any money saved toward the engine got reassigned to the Broken shifter repairs. It could also have damaged my transmission. Right now I know I need the shift boot from Japan, to replace one of the CV boots that was torn as a result, and that I need a new water pump. I am simply assuming that I will need to start saving towards engine repairs all over again by the time I get it fixed from the Broken shifter issue. I've been debating Sphenicie's suggestion of a strong replacement engine. While it may be possible to find a strong replacement engine for $200'ish, and Pick N Pull's pricing confirms it, their selection and availability did not raise my hopes. I still don't understand how I can know if it is a good engine or will just have it's own set of problems. Plus, I can't help but wonder about the oil check valve. I don't know if my engine has it, and I wouldn't know if a replacement engine had it... with the possible exception of sourcing an engine from a forum member here. That then begs the question, how much to have a G10 engine shipped? After paying for both the engine, and for the shipping, would I still have spent less money than if I rebuild my current engine? If I rebuild by current engine, I can confirm the oil check valve, I have the option of following Sphenicie's oil fart fix advice from his sleuthing article. I can look into options of sourcing from 3Tech, Geo Glenn, possibly the Japan source, and/or others which I have yet to learn of. I have the option of following along with Geo Glenn's favorites list. ...But how much more money might I need to spend to do all that? And that does not even cover machining the engine. I think I need to open a new thread to explore these options. If I were to take the direction of rebuilding the current engine, I'd want to figure out in advance exactly what I wanted to do. Ryan, where are you in your project? |
![]() |
|
| Old Man | Dec 9 2013, 02:33 AM Post #67 |
![]()
|
broken shifter fix http://geometroforum.com/topic/5312407/1/#new |
![]() |
|
| omniminded | Dec 9 2013, 02:54 AM Post #68 |
![]()
|
Thanks. perfesser already suggested this minus the thread link, but I'm sourcing the part new from Japan. |
![]() |
|
| Metromightymouse | Dec 9 2013, 05:57 AM Post #69 |
|
Powdercoat Wizard
![]()
|
Deep breaths. Slow and easy. Breath in. Breath out. Now curse the Surburban for being soo expensive to run even if it is repaired. Now, here is the process I use to buy a motor from PnP. Step one, answer the question "why is it here?" If the answer doesn't jump out at you looking at the exterior there is a pretty good chance it's in the engine compartment. If the exterior looks ok check the frame horns and see if that is a clear reason for it to be there. If you have a choice between a car that looks good and a car that has been in a collision, take the collision car. Best case is a car that is really clean but been hit and has low mileage. Hopefully you have a few choices at this point. Second, check mileage. If it's got over 150k I would prefer to walk away. Sometimes the cars will have been for sale as a builder and will have information on the windshield. Having it say "Runs" or something similar is a point in it's favor. Third, overall condition. Interior look cared for? Paint in amazing shape for how old the car is and it hasn't been repainted in the last 5 or 10 years. Several of these items go both ways. Paint - new paint may be an indicator that someone was spending money on the car to bring it up to snuff, point if there is collision damage. If there isn't collision damage it likely indicates they got to the engine/ trans and didn't have the money to fix what's wrong, strike. Original paint with expected fading or oxidation. With as old as our cars are paint would be expected to be damaged even if it isn't neglected. Combined with nothing else looking trashed and a clear reason for it to be there, big point. Trashed paint, trashed interior, things replaced just to keep it on the road, mismatched parts, improvised repairs, non standard parts (as seen in the wall of shame), big strike. Fourth, the heart of the beast, engine compartment. Like our last step, this one goes both ways and requires looking at the other indicators as well. Cleaned engine compartment, and cleaned car, no collision damage, strike, collision damage, this is a car that was likely gone through, point. Dirty engine but not coated in oil, not loaded on miles, normal looking interior, clear reason for it to be here, gold point. Oil caked motor/ trans, this one is tricky, best guess where it came from, valve cover, oil cap, dip stick tube, distributor, half shafts, oil pan, trans (and you're shopping for an engine), all no big deal, with other good indicators point. Crank seal, rear main seal, Since it isn't cleaned it likely wasn't fixed, good chance it ran low on oil, strike. Leak from the head? Check the overflow bottle and radiator for chunky clay stuff to confirm blown headgasket. This one is up to you. This could be why it's here and if you don't mind replacing it, it can be a good purchase. Fifth, direct inspection. Rotate the engine, any difficulty? Feel any grinding? Do you feel the normal compression strokes or is it too easy? Look under the oil cap, any evidence of water in the oil? Look in the valve cover, same thing as well as look for any carnage or rust. Pull the sparkplugs, are they all uniform and brown or black and gunky or carboned up. Uniform, gold point. Gunky black, big strike. Carboned, might be ok. The oil should be drained but that doesn't mean you can't inspect it. Remove the drain plug and stick a finger up inside, what do you come back with? Sludge? Metal particles? Clean Oil? Black oil? Pull the oil filter if they left it on and do the same checks. Milky oil would indicate a headgasket. Check the filter for metal particles if it's there stick a finger in the middle hole where the filter mounts if it isn't. You are looking for metal again. The above checks should be doable in 15 to 20 minutes and should be sufficient to make an educated purchase. If you want to dig deeper here are a couple of options. You can pull the valve cover to get a look at the full cam. Pull the head to inspect pistons, cylinders and valves. Pull the oil pan to inspect the rods and anything left in the bottom of the pan. Pull the EGR valve, are the passages completely blocked? not a good sign for the valves. Alternatively you can purchase a borescope, http://www.harborfreight.com/digital-inspection-camera-67979.html and use it to look in the valve cover and inspect the cam and if it will fit in the oil drain hole inspect the bottom of the motor. Unfortunately, as sold the lens will not fit in a sparkplug hole but you can look into the cylinder and see some of the condition. I am going to post this in the how to section as well. Hope this helps with your decision. Edited by Metromightymouse, Dec 9 2013, 06:16 AM.
|
![]() |
|
| omniminded | Dec 9 2013, 04:11 PM Post #70 |
![]()
|
So I presume the "Honey Hole" is a junkyard near you? Without me making assumptions, what sort of places would you search if you were looking for your own sake? I was going to suggest that you post it as a guide in How-to as well. It helps with my education, and my education helps my decision. But then there is my confidence level which is simply not high period. I don't know what shipping a motor would cost, but I suppose I like the idea of an engine with a forum history from an established forum member better than one from a junkyard. Opening things up for a better look seems like the way to go. I suppose it comes down to how much the gaskets cost that will need to be replaced. Thing is, I'm paying John labor because I simply don't know enough about this to diy. It's still far preferable and costs WAY less than a shop, but it's still money I need to factor in. If he rebuilds, or if he swaps, it comes down to how long either takes + the cost of the parts. Which sum total is more favorable? That is what I need to figure out, as well as if I am comfortable enough with the prospect of an engine swap to do it if it proves the less costly option. I found the rebuild guides in the How-to section and began reading through those. I am trying to better understand what is potentially involved in a rebuild. But I am still unclear what needs doing if I rebuild mine... well frankly, aside from being told in this thread (and by John) that I need a rebuild, I still don't really even understand why. I keep looking through the forum trying to pick up what I can as I go. I am trying to piece together what I can. Some of what I've picked up and pieced together:
I'm still confused on the valve terminology too. Hm, and I don't know which gasket Sphencie means to have large holes. Edit: added 3Tech valve springs Edited by omniminded, Dec 9 2013, 05:33 PM.
|
![]() |
|
| Highwayman | Jan 18 2014, 06:44 PM Post #71 |
![]()
|
There are establishments who do nothing but import low mileage engines from Japan. Here in Idaho, I look in the phone book and see [Japanese Import Motors 1-800-365 3742] and [Low Mileage Engines From Japan / 1year unlimited mileage warranty- 1 800-552 1595] etc. These company's will ship any where and are inexpensive. I would avoid a junk yard like the plague. The reason a Geo is in the junk yard is because it has an engine which needs overhauled, or has been smashed in a wreck. Having overhauled many of these geos, I will say you don't want any mechanic touching one of these unless they have years of experience working on geos. If a geo owner can't repair these themselves, they will not love them because any repair is going to be too expensive. That is why I own a dozen of them and try to rescue as many as I can before they go to the junk yard. The last engine I bought from the local junk yard was aimed to be a 1999 with 35000 miles. I took it to my shop and tried to turn it over prior to installation. Something went clunk. I pulled the head and could see the cylinders looked like new. I poured Marvel mystery oil on the pistons and it ran right past into the oil pan.I had to pull the pistons and carefully free up the stuck piston rings. It has a cast cam gear which is broken and not a available any where so I will have to modify it to the stamped gear system. It will work out but I would have been better off buying one from a importer with a warranty. |
![]() |
|
| Metromightymouse | Jan 20 2014, 08:40 PM Post #72 |
|
Powdercoat Wizard
![]()
|
Problem, the JDM motor supply for our cars has mostly dried up. Tiger claimed to have one (or a supply) recently but calls to most companies will end with it not being available. The lowest price I have heard recently is $600 plus $200 shipping and this may be an engine that has sat for an extended time, leaving you in the same boat as the JY motor. |
![]() |
|
| omniminded | Jan 20 2014, 10:06 PM Post #73 |
![]()
|
JDM motors were brought up a while ago. Looked at as an option, and after examining the issue, dismissed. The mention of the supply being dried up is new. Not very surprising though. At this point, it's looking like either super careful with a JY motor, or save up till I can get a GG. Locally, there are no JY motors available. I've poured a fair amount of money into the Geo at this point and it is running for the time being. Other things have come up which must take precedence. For now, the Geo will need to wait. And since there are so many abbreviations... JDM = Japanese Domestic Market JY = Junk Yard GG = Geo Glenn AA = Abbreviations Anonymous?? Edited by omniminded, Jan 20 2014, 10:07 PM.
|
![]() |
|
| Stubby | Feb 4 2014, 04:49 AM Post #74 |
|
Advanced Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
I have the same issue. Brand new rebuild, but I'm going to start cheap and work my way up. PCV valve delete is first thing on the list. I'll let you know. |
![]() |
|
| Freeman | Feb 4 2014, 06:40 AM Post #75 |
|
The Family Man
![]()
|
This would be why I suggest a head gasket. A leak down or compression test would be a good start. |
![]() |
|
| 1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous) | |
| Go to Next Page | |
| « Previous Topic · Intake and Exhaust Systems · Next Topic » |


Welcome to the all new Geo Metro Forum. We hope you enjoy your visit.







![]](http://z3.ifrm.com/static/1/pip_r.png)

Deep breaths. Slow and easy. Breath in. Breath out. Now curse the Surburban for being soo expensive to run even if it is repaired. Now, here is the process I use to buy a motor from PnP.
7:58 PM Jul 10