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| How Much Clutch is Left | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Dec 26 2013, 04:58 AM (2,163 Views) | |
| Thart10 | Dec 26 2013, 04:58 AM Post #1 |
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I gotta do the Lower Control Arms on my 90 Metro LSi. While the front end is apart might be a good time to drop the Trans and R & R the Clutch, but I don't want to do that if the Clutch is good for another 50k or so. The car has 204k miles, I'm 2nd owner and the PO took good care of it, I just didn't get any service records with it. Is there any way, based on Free Play & Cable Adjustment to tell how much Clutch Disc I have left? Trans works fine, except for a leaky seal at the shifter linkage and an occasional "squeal" that I'm pretty sure is just the worn out Pilot Shaft Bushing, spinning in the Crankshaft when the engine is cool. |
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| Metromightymouse | Dec 26 2013, 05:44 AM Post #2 |
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Powdercoat Wizard
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Since spring tension and other factors would affect those items there is nothing you can check or measure externally that would reliably tell the state of the clutch. The only reliable way to asses it is to remove and measure it's thickness to verify whether it is still within spec. |
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| t3ragtop | Dec 26 2013, 08:33 AM Post #3 |
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Turbo3 and Twincam Tweaker
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personally, i've never hauled one down for a clutch inspection that i didn't just replace it all. the labor is the biggest part of it and at 200+ thousand miles i would replace the clutch, pressure plate, pilot bearing and throw out bearing. i'm also a big fan of swapping to the g13 flywheel. since i have easy access to a shop that reconditions drive line components i have flywheels ground and balanced prior to installing them. the g13 flywheel is lighter than the g10's and the clutch disc is a larger diameter. |
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| Memphis metro | Dec 26 2013, 08:57 AM Post #4 |
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I go a step further myself. I never haul one down that is functioning ok or I am doing a engine or transmission swap or repair that required pulling either the engine or transmission first. If it is working, do not worry about it. Do not tear it down, just to inspect it. You may wreck the car and never need a new clutch. In other words, fix it when you pull the engine or transmission or when the clutch displays a problem. Other than that, do not worry about it. |
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| perfesser | Dec 26 2013, 09:10 AM Post #5 |
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Elite Member - Former Metro owner
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Let's see now ... 200+k, you already know you have a leaky seal and you suspect the pilot bearing is bad. There'll never be a better time to go in and just do it! It's lots easier to do it, even if it is a bit early, on your schedule than to wait until it tells you it's done. |
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| Thart10 | Dec 27 2013, 04:22 AM Post #6 |
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Thanks for the TIPS! The ONLY thing "wrong" with the Geo at this point is a worn out Lower Arm Rear Bushing on the left side. This allows a little Side-to-Side Wiggle on the LF wheel. I've got a FREE set of 175 70 13 (11 year old "Maypops") on it now that may last another 20,000 miles, even with the bad Alignment. I just gave my baby girl a 97 Camry that might have lasted me 5-10 more years. I towed it then drove the GEO home from OKC, only to find out I had a BAD LF Wheel Bearing. Fixed that, only to find the rear LF A-Arm bushing was shot. It started Snowing so I've been driving my 444k mile 92 Corolla, "beater". for the last two months, then it started complaining two weeks ago. Been at least 125k since last Timing Belt and the Tension Pulley is the problem. There's nothing here I can't do or haven't done before, but my 78 Fiat X 1/9 Project car is stored in the UNHEATED garage where I do ALL my own work, until the Spring Thaw. It's a matter of How Much Do I PAY someone, with a heated work space, to get the Corolla to 500K or the Geo to 300K so I can spend next Summer finishing the restoration of the Fiat? How many of you have 1990 Geo Metros with 200k+ miles on them with the Original Engine & Trans? I've finally got some Dry weather for a few days, so I can see how the Geo handles on the "May Pops". If they are "acceptable", even in light rain, then I can pay someone to get the Corolla ready to face the NEXT Big Snow storm. If not, I've got TWO sets of 185 60 R 13's, that "Tire Rack" has been bugging me for SIX months to review. I already have TWO, NEW, Lower Control Arms, because the only thing left to wear out is the Ball Joints so why not just get that over with now? Shade Tree Mechanic's Rule #1: Whichever car I spend the MOST money on, will be the first one to BREAK something else. Sorry to run on so long, but I found out years ago, when trying to talk to the EX, that sometimes, just trying to explain my situation to someone else would help me identify the real problem. Come to think of it, I haven't had anything but "Car Problems" since she left. Santa didn't bring me a new Bong, but I found some Reindeer Poop for the old one. Man! That's some Goood .
Edited by Thart10, Dec 27 2013, 04:57 AM.
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| yummybacon | Dec 27 2013, 03:51 PM Post #7 |
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When my engine was out recently I went ahead and replaced everything.Did it need to be done ?No but as long as I had everything out I thought I would just go for it.Now I have a good but used clutch and flywheel on my shelf. |
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| davegran | Dec 27 2013, 04:32 PM Post #8 |
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Old Fart w/Wrenches
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Once the clutch friction disc is out, sitting in front of you, it is very easy to tell how much it is worn. The depth from the surface of the disc down to the rivets starts out at .050" brand new; the recommended minimum depth for deciding to replace is .020", a .030" tolerance. So, when the depth is, for example, .035" your clutch is 50% worn. I like to scuff up the friction disc and the flywheel with some 80 or 100 grit sandpaper to knock off any glaze when I re-use them. Don't get any greasy/oily fingerprints on any of the friction surfaces.... |
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| yummybacon | Dec 27 2013, 08:33 PM Post #9 |
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Lets not forget you have a throw out bearing that might need changing as well. |
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| Murf 59 | Dec 27 2013, 09:12 PM Post #10 |
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Don't forget the pilot bearing too.
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| awames76 | Dec 27 2013, 09:48 PM Post #11 |
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rear main seal and trans input seal, and any other seals that may be there, dont remember if there are any. be a real shame if they started to leak a few months after u put a clutch in |
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| Thart10 | Dec 28 2013, 04:52 AM Post #12 |
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Think I'll just drive it until something breaks, then fix everything I can reach. The Worn out Control Arm Bushing only causes a slight pull to the left. A slight "Tweaking" of the Tie Rod might "fix" that? If it last until Summer, I can do it all myself and save all the Labor Cost. I just need one or two WARM days to R & R the Starter, Alternator, Regulator & Oil Pressure Sender on the Fiat so I can move it out of my work space. Later, it will get a "new" Ignition Switch, an Upgrade to the Turn Signal/Wiper Combo Switch assembly and an Electronic Distributor in place of all those 36 year old parts. With it available for Summer Cruisin', I can do the Geo work and Corolla Timing Belt on rainy days. With Three cars, as long as I can keep Two of them operable, it gives my Semi-reTIRED AZZ the Luxury of fixing things on MY Schedule. The irony is, I'm trying to keep my two oldest cars running the longest, because the newest and most dependable one has the most miles. Now, the only thing I can do is see if the Auto Godz agree with my plan A. |
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| Cobrajet25 | Dec 28 2013, 06:33 AM Post #13 |
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It has been my experience that the pressure plate will fail on these cars before the clutch disc wears out. How does the pedal feel? If it is stiff and grabby, it's clutch time. Otherwise, I'd just run it until there was a problem. These cars are easy to pull apart, so any labor savings you'd get by doing it now would be minimal. |
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| yummybacon | Dec 28 2013, 05:40 PM Post #14 |
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| yummybacon | Dec 28 2013, 05:49 PM Post #15 |
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Time before last I went out to my car pushed down on the peddle and I felt something pop in the peddle. One of the arms on the presure plate bent in well thats all she wrote.When I pulled the gear box I could see that there was some clutch left but not much. |
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