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Radiator flushing; Full of rust/sludge
Topic Started: Jun 9 2014, 08:24 PM (828 Views)
Cobb
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So my 2010 honda insight has 100 thousand miles. About 50 thousand miles it was in an accident and had the radiator replaced, water pump and coolant twice. The water pump wasnt discovered til after radiator was replaced. I know the type 2 coolant honda sells that is blue in color says 5 years or 60 thousand miles. Since this was done, I paid no mind to it.

Fast forward to last week. I went to unscrew the petcock and nothing happened. I removed the petcock and a slight trickle came out the radiator. The rear of the plug was a lump of sludge and rust. :banghead I collected what I could then got out the water hose.

I got a lot of blue liquid out of the car from the various hoses, but no rust, nor brown color water like in previous vehicles Ive serviced. After 15 minutes of chasing the blue water from every orifice I notice the drain plug was gushing water out the bottom of the radiator.

I went ahead and installed a new t stat and a bottle of peak flush and water. The bottle says I need to drive the car 3-6 hours then flush it twice before adding antifreeze. Going to use peak 5 year 150k mile yellow antifreeze for all vehicles.

So...... :whistle Anything else I should do? Should I consider doing a second bottle of flush? The system holds like 6 qts of fluid.

Thx. :cheers
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snowfish
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Basic GearHead

Sounds like you got about as good as it's going to get. :thumb Light years better than 90% of the rest of the population. ^o)

Remember that some pure water will remain in the system. :hmm I mix a little rich, not a lot, to compensate. ^o) Just remember to double check, the freeze point, before the temps drop again. :cold
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Cobb
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:rocker You got a point there. Just pissed me off I let it get that far since Ive been rather anal in servicing this car. :cheers
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Greywolf
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Mostly Harmless

Any cooling system that gets jacked up that bad on one of mine I pull the radiator out of and back-flush it thoroughly.
I also flush out the block and heads.

I have found that doing a basic flush with everything connected is a recipe for a repeat performance, by taking the radiator completely out I can make sure I get everything out of the system - and when I go to this length to flush the system I pull out the thermostat at least temporarily so there is no flow restriction in the engine at all.

I ALSO BACK FLUSH THE HEATER CORE!!!
~The reason for that is to make sure it isn't hiding any stuff in it that will get into the radiator the very next time the heater is used, which isn't often in the summer time, is it?

*TIP: Wrap a rag around the end of a garden hose so that it makes a tight fit in the engine side radiator hose connectors. Run the water full blast until it comes out clear as can be. Flush the radiator from the BOTTOM hose connector. Flush the engine by removing the thermostat, putting the cover back on with the old gasket, and using a wrapped hose like I mentioned. Flush the heater core through the hoses IN BOTH DIRECTIONS and be sure to switch the dash selector lever to the full heat position first.

* Never run less than a 50/50 mix of antifreeze. Your water pump seals will be happier that way. Only an idiot runs plain water - antifreeze isn't just to prevent freezing.
Edited by Greywolf, Jun 28 2014, 05:44 PM.
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myredvert
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myredvert

snowfish
 
Remember that some pure water will remain in the system. :hmm
Right about some water remaining and affecting the mix, but I sure wouldn't call it "pure!"

When filling the system and not using "pre-mix," distilled water can help prevent problems that can be caused by either "hard" or "soft" tap water. It's very cheap insurance.
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charliesdad
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Have any pics on backflushing?
I have never done that.

Charlierdad
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Cobb
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Yup, I disconnected a few hoses and stock the water hose inside and gripped the hose around the hose to make a tighter seal. I was shocked at how long it ran til the water was clear from the heater core. Also removed the tstat. I set the heater to high and let the car run with just water in it, then drained water and refilled with water plus flush. I drove the car for a week, then flushed that out. I did put the t stat back in it before driving the car. The flush water was a light blue. I removed the tstat and did the same back flushing, but left the radiator in the car. Dis appointed I couldnt find rusty water like I did the old dodge van I had. I did the hose flushing twice, then let everything drain, reinstalled tstat. I used peak 50/50.

Guess Im just shocked at the fact its a new car, 1 owner and the radiator was replaced at 58 thousand miles and all the special blue honda coolant. So in 42 thousand miles it became full of rust? If it was a used radiator then since its such a new car I would be equally as puzzled. Plus, I think the block is aluminum. :banghead

Where the hell would there be iron in the system to generate rust?!?!?! :smackface

Now the dodge wagoneer with its 318 I got a flush hose kit and I had the water hose on for 45 minutes and saw nothing but mud like water come out the open ends. :shake After an hour and a large pool of water under the van I called BS and used 3 bottles of flush and drove around a while. Another flush and after 30 minutes the rusty muddy water turned clear. :cheers
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Memphis metro


charliesdad
Jun 28 2014, 06:43 PM
Have any pics on backflushing?
I have never done that.

Charlierdad
Here is some for a metro

http://geometroforum.com/single/?p=549212&t=4464045
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Cobb
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Yup, thats the flush kit I was talking about. Yup, removed the radiator drain plug and gave the water no where else to go. It was blasting out the hole.

Funny thing, the honda never saw any rusty water, just blue toilet bowl like water to light blue, then clear.

Now both vans I own, yeah, nice brown rusty water for seemed like an hour. :banghead

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Woodie
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Greywolf
Jun 28 2014, 05:32 PM
I ALSO BACK FLUSH THE HEATER CORE!!!
~The reason for that is to make sure it isn't hiding any stuff in it that will get into the radiator the very next time the heater is used, which isn't often in the summer time, is it?
Metro heater core core has full flow through it at all times. Many other cars have a valve, but Metro/Swift do not. Nice to think in the middle of the summer that there is a nice 210° box of water next to your right knee.
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myredvert
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myredvert

Quote:
 
Where the hell would there be iron in the system to generate rust?!?!?! :smackface
One common cause of otherwise "inexplicable" corrosion is due to a higher concentration of multivalent cations from an otherwise "harmless" tap water supply than a particular cooling system component can tolerate. In other words, some minerals that can help destroy a cooling systems may be in there because we put them in there. :smackface

It seems like most manufacturer's procedures for servicing cooling systems anymore recommend (when not using "pre-mixed" anti freeze products) to use distilled water specifically to eliminate the potential that some minerals commonly found in "hard" water or electrolytes formed as a byproduct of producing "soft" water have to either cause, encourage and/or accelerate corrosion and produce undesirable "limescale" or calcium type deposits in the system.

The types and levels of minerals in different local water supplies can vary widely. Some people can use tap water for years with no serious issues, while others can use it and find their cooling system ruined because of it. Whenever I think of using our mineral rich tap water in a freshly flushed cooling system, I imagine Shaun Connery playing a radiator repair guy, and cautioning me "be careful my friend, some things in there may not react well to bullets tap water..." :O
Edited by myredvert, Jun 29 2014, 12:00 PM.
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Greywolf
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Mostly Harmless

The block may be aluminum - but the cylinder sleeves are made out of steel.

The rust is likely from the sides of the cylinder sleeves that are inside the coolant jacket.

*It points to a poor mix of coolant, or inferior coolant.
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Cobb
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:popcorn That makes sense. I know early on the over flow bottle was low, so I ended up buying a gallon of honda antifreeze just to top it off. Im sure at the shop they could of done anything.

Just checked it, nice and clear inside the fluid. The fluid is a neon green that I put in it, peak 50/50. I know pre diluted some say is a waste of money, but I also know you just cant pour any old water into the system. :cheers
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Old Man


Using tap water from the garden hose puts chemicals found in tap water into your cooling system.
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Greywolf
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In with my theme of "Only trust what I do myself" I like to get full strength antifreeze and actually mix it a bit stronger than needed.
A good mix will prevent rust/corrosion (and these engines are a perfect example of different metals that can form a corrosion cell) and also lubricate and protect seals. The pump impeller is also usually steel or iron, and AF also helps make that last a lot longer.
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