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I'm tired of paying Firestone $100 for an alignment; Well, I fixed that today
Topic Started: Jul 4 2015, 09:58 PM (1,054 Views)
dayle1960
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Fastest Hampster EVER

Sometimes being cheap causes you to think outside of the box for solutions. Today was one of those days. Every time I need an alignment on my vehicles I have to trolly on down to Firestone and waste a couple of hours while they do their voodoo. My F-150 has been chewing my rubber after putting in new camber bolts and I just was tired of going to Firestone. So I trolled the F-150 websites and came across a post showing a tool used by DIY'ers who have the same mindset as myself.

We all can use a string, two jack stands, and a measuring tape to set the toe-in on most cars. But what was causing me headaches was dealing with the camber. How do you set it when the wheel droops so much while in the air? This tool, http://www.ebay.com/itm/Magnetic-Alignment-Camber-Castor-Gauge-Strut-Wheel-Truck-Car-/171789343150?hash=item27ff7159ae&vxp=mtr will make my life much better. For $35 shipped to the house I can now set the camber on my whips.

Fortunately a poster came up with the specs on angle of degree and minutes for my particular F-150 and I will be golden if I set it to zero. I'm thinking by eyeballing it I have about 2 degrees of negative camber. Before I changed the bolts I must have had about 6 degrees of positive camber. But this is not a bad situation because I need new tires anyways. I figure as long as I don't go driving on wet roads I should have a bunch of traction due to no grooves in the treads. B-)

Hope this tool helps somebody.
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perfesser
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Elite Member - Former Metro owner

It's amazing how many jobs can be demystified by finding the step by step directions and carefully following them. Good for you for taking a step beyond your comfort zone!!
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robertino
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Uhhhh....I likey ! New tools always pep me up!(Scooby Snacks) But does the F150 even have an adjustment for Camber ? or do you have to get concentric bolts in there to adjust that. Kinda like these http://www.carid.com/2009-ford-f-150-suspension-parts/moog-alignment-camber-bolt-38340231.html
Usually if the camber and caster is off on a car that doesn't have the alignment bolts for such adjustments, it usually means something is bent or worn out.
Edited by robertino, Jul 7 2015, 10:42 PM.
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sixtharmy


Dayle, I respect your cheapness and generally I like to be able to work on my own car rather than pay someone else. However, about 12 years ago when I bought/rescued my Metro I paid Firestone for lifetime alignments (about $100 at the time now about $190). Each year I have them inspect it, since I have to have someone inspect it and since they usually give me a half-off inspection coupon. While they inspect I have them do an alignment. Occasionally, when the steering feels strange, or I replace tires or suspension or steering components, I take it in for an additional alignment. I think the alignments are costing me about $5 or $6 now and getting cheaper each year. I also usually pay Wally World for lifetime (of tires) balance and rotation each time I buy a new set of tires. (I get the tires on-line and have to have someone mount them anyway.) I have them do their thing about twice a year (about every 5K miles) and over the 4 or 5 year life of a set of tires I end up spending about $5 for each balance and rotate. Annually 2 balance and rotate, 2 alignments, and an inspection cost me about $25. Apart from these services and having Butch weld on new exhaust pieces every now and then (I think there's still one piece of pipe he hasn't replaced.), I've never had anyone other than myself work on the car. I don't think it would have been cheaper to buy the equipment I would have needed to perform these jobs. Again, I applaud your diligence in finding DIY ways to save on service. I just think some slightly less skillful owners might prefer my slightly more relaxed level of cheapness.
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Freeman
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The Family Man

perfesser
Jul 4 2015, 10:06 PM
It's amazing how many jobs can be demystified by finding the step by step directions and carefully following them. Good for you for taking a step beyond your comfort zone!!
:rocker

Like engine swaps and car tuning. The internet is truly a beautiful creation.

Congrats on the whole thing Dayle, but I am pretty cautious myself. Sixtharmy sort of made a point I'd make. There are some things that I don't feel comfortable doing myself.
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dayle1960
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Fastest Hampster EVER

Aw, come on TurbeEF. It's simply an x-y axis leveling tool. Heck, I know Firestone has the super duper model, but why cannot a shadetree mechanic do the same thing. It's not like I'm taking a chance by doing it myself. Appears to me the only downside is that I would set the concentric bolts incorrectly and start scrubbing rubber off of my tires. As long as I am within a few minutes of dead "0" then I should be good. I bet Firestone has the ability to set the camber to within one or two minutes, whereas I might get it as close as 5 minutes.

I don't drive my F-150 that much so I won't be scrubbing too much rubber off the tires for a long time. So I think I'll be good for four or five years, as long as I get the camber settings very close to "0".

Sixtharmy.........I think your way of doing things is fine. I have no complaints except for one: Sitting in the waiting area for at least an hour while the techs do their voodoo. My time is spent doing other things instead of wasting my time watching the techs do "other things" than doing what I'm there for them to do. For example, I just took my wife's van to walmart because it had a screw in the tire. I drove up and the bays were empty. Then only thing ahead of me was a trailer tire being replaced on the rim. Three techs were walking around the bays. I had to wait for over an hour to get my tire repaired. AND THAT WAS BEING FIRST IN LINE. Just makes me mad to wait. But if you are into that, I have no beef with you, I just cannot tolerate that kind of watchable lameness.
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z34-5speed
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Formerly "Tech Certified"

I've got lifetime alignment through Firestone on 3 of my vehicles. Worth every penny!
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sixtharmy


I hear where you're coming from Dayle. I hate the waiting too. I get to Firestone as they open in the AM. It usually takes a couple of minutes to do the paperwork and in about 10 minutes I see the Tech walking out to get the car. (I make a point of talking to the Tech both before and after the work.) I walk out to him and mention (honestly) that I changed the brake shoes X years ago, but if he removes a brake drum during the inspection, then would he please swap the stake nuts so they'll hold properly and safely. I also mention that they torque to 74 ft-lbs and the lug nuts only torque to 44. I say everyone over-torques the lugs, because they're not used to working on such a light car and that shops have had to replace a couple of snapped studs and a warped rotor because of over-tightening. I'm pretty sure no inspector's removed a drum in the last 6 or 7 years. The first couple of years they'd fail the car for something small and I'd tell them I'd fix it and bring it back. They hate that because they only get paid for the first inspection. As I remember, the second year they said it needed new wipers, so I rummaged around the spare tire and pulled out a new pair still in the packaging and popped them on before the Tech walked away. He wasn't too happy because, having written up the fail paperwork, he now had to write up the passed paperwork. After year 2, I think we reached an understanding. The long term counter guys at Firestone realize I only want an inspection and an alignment. They get me out of there pretty quick so they can get to someone who'll pay them to do repairs. I seldom spend more than half an hour to 45 minutes drinking coffee, jawing with the guys at the counter, and watching the tech out in the bay as I wait. The last time they found anything wrong with the car was about 6 years ago. There was a pinhole leak at the top of an exhaust weld. I told them I'd take it down to Butch and his brother. They said, "Oh you know Butch too?", and they passed the car. (It seems for some unknown reason that everyone in Richmond that has anything to do with cars knows Butch and his brother. It's not like they're the only muffler shop around.) I follow the same sort of procedure at Wally World. It doesn't work quite as well, because the personnel changes too fast. I still make a point of talking to the Tech and if he seems competent sometimes I'll slip him a five (for an after work beer) to make sure he gets the lug nuts right. I'm never comfortable having someone work on my car, but I'm not so uncomfortable that I'm going to invest in an alignment rack or a dynamic balance machine. Again, I applaud your dedication to tight-fistedness.
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Coyote X


Or you could pay 5 bucks for a pair of laser pointers and align it to 0.00 yourself. http://geometroforum.com/topic/4996914/

Once you do it the first time and get the hang of it you can align the car faster than it takes you to round up your tools to do it.
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Stubby79
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$100? eww. I've only paid for an alignment once...and they told me they couldn't adjust anything on that particular car, so they didn't actually do anything. Yay. But it didn't cost nearly that much.
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Bjetmech
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z34-5speed
Jul 8 2015, 06:51 PM
I've got lifetime alignment through Firestone on 3 of my vehicles. Worth every penny!
:gp

Same here.
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snowfish
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Basic GearHead

Quote:
 
two jack stands, and a measuring tape to set the toe-in

Better double check measurements, including camber, with the car on the ground. :news Adjustments need to be made with the suspension under load. ^o)
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sixtharmy


CoyoteX, I was about 9 years into my lifetime 4 wheel alignments when you posted that. With a few extra alignments along the way I figure it was costing me about $8 a year then. Really waiting at Firestone's not that bad. There's always free fresh coffee and a newspaper, and sometimes there are interesting people to talk to. If I figure in the cost of a couple of cups of coffee, I'm getting near the point where the alignments are free. I have to take it in for the annual inspection anyway, and they only charge me half the going rate for that. The extra bit of time for the alignment isn't unbearable.
Rick, I'm trying to remember. I met you at Geopalooza last year or the year before and thanked you for your 4 wire O2 sensor mod. I remember you mentioned something you were working on that interested me, but I can't remember what it was. Oh, I remember now. You were talking about adapting a standard GM cruise control to the metro. I checked your MetroXFi site a couple of times,but never saw any follow-up. I probably forgot about it because I found a Rostera in a dead vert at the junkyard. I think they charged me $12 for it. All the wiring and the throttle adapter were there so installation was a breeze. Right now I'm trying to find a free or real cheap unrebuidable head to use as an exchange core for when I buy a rebuidable head at the local pick-n-pull. Hope to see you again at Geopalooza this year.
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Coyote X


sixtharmy: I never did write up the gm cruise control thing. I have it all worked out I just never got around to installing it on the car. I really should work on it since I need to do a few things to my car this weekend. Ill be there with my white XFi this year.

I will probably have to realign my car after I put new boots on the steering rack so if I do I will try and get a video of how to do it. That would probably make it a lot easier to understand and see how easy it really is.
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dayle1960
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Fastest Hampster EVER

Well, I got my camber alignment tool yesterday. It is so cool. There are openings through my wheel spokes that I can pass the tool through and stick it onto my rotor. Sweet!

Only problem is that there were no instructions included with the tool. There is writing on the outside of the box, in CHINESE, but I unfortunately cannot read chinese. There are graduations on the tool from positive 6 down to negative 6. Should I take that as the number of degrees + or - on the gauge? Or are those numbers in minutes?

Sorry to be asking these questions, but I have trolled youtube for a tutorial on how to use this gauge, but I guess I am not finding videos which show it in action.
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