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175/60r13 Anyone Try? Stock Rim Width?
Topic Started: Aug 7 2015, 03:54 PM (950 Views)
Cardinal Grammeter
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Should have the same OD as the 165/65r13 which is awesome.

Wondering it the stock 13x4.5's are too narrow?
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Car Nut
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Stick with 175 70 13. Cheaper/ easier to find.
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Physics_Outlaw
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Physics_Outlaw
[ *  *  * ]
Car Nut
Aug 7 2015, 08:43 PM
Stick with 175 70 13. Cheaper/ easier to find.
:gp

I ran a set of Firestone Winterforce tires that size year round for three years. Noisy but good in water and snow. Tread wear was phenomenal.
Edited by Physics_Outlaw, Aug 7 2015, 09:59 PM.
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Old Man


I used 175/60-13s on stock 13in rims. Came that way on my 'Vert. On those rims long enough for the tires to wear at least 75%---no problems
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Cardinal Grammeter
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Old Man
Aug 7 2015, 10:11 PM
I used 175/60-13s on stock 13in rims. Came that way on my 'Vert. On those rims long enough for the tires to wear at least 75%---no problems
Are you saying you ran those tires until 25% tread was left and no problems?

I've had 175/70r13's and they are way too tall for the steep hills in SW PA.

I have a new set of 165/65r13 Sunny's but am in the process of "using up" the tires on my one set of 13" rims. I also have a bunch of 12's that have good rubber to be used up.

And then there is my last set of 175/75r12 A008's for my Festiva alloys - but I'm not going to run them until I replace the shocks. After they are gone, I'll probably stick with 13's - either the 165/65's or the 175/60's. But I'll need to get another set of 13" wheels - one set is not enough.
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myredvert
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myredvert

Websites like Tire-rack.com give specific manufacturer's specs for the rim width range for most tires.
Quote:
 
I've had 175/70r13's and they are way too tall for the steep hills in SW PA.
With a tired low compression engine and/or not using the torque curve well enough - maybe, but even with up to a 3.79 13's should not be "too big." People drive up and down bigger hills/mountains than that everyday with the spec 13" tire diameter and 4.10 final drives. And even taller.
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Old Man


Cardinal Grammeter
Aug 8 2015, 12:21 PM
Are you saying you ran those tires until 25% tread was left and no problems?

I've had 175/70r13's and they are way too tall for the steep hills in SW PA.


Yes, that is what I am saying.

You need to utilize your power curve better. Those tires would not be "way too tall" if you reved up to 4500-5000 rpm before shifting when running the "steep hills of PA"

At this time I have 185/65-15s and a 4.1 tranny and I have no problems running the mountain passes. Might end up in third gear running 70MPH but it doesn't even slow down..........
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Cardinal Grammeter
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It's not about revs and shifting, it's about pulling out on steep hills and not killing the clutch. Sometimes I have over 500# (sometimes 750# - which is overloaded - 550# factory limit) of combined passengers in the car and let me tell you, that really puts the kibosh on things. And then there is hauling chip stone in buckets, building materials, and engines,etc. I just my 5-door like a truck. But when empty, I drive like sports car - a day doesn't go by where I don't squeal a tire around a corner.

The rim width question is I'm into handling and rim width has a big impact on responsiveness. The recommended rim with on the A008 175/70r12's is 5-6 inches. So I wonder how "bad" 175/60r13's would be on a 4.5" rim. I've had 175/70r13's, and while acceptable, I felt more rim would improve them. When the aspect ratio gets lower, rim width is more critical.

But I have 2 new sets of tires to use up and some used ones before I can try them(!) But I am very curious since 1-2 years ago, there were no 175/60r13's available anywhere.
Edited by Cardinal Grammeter, Aug 9 2015, 08:11 AM.
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myredvert
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myredvert

Does your car still have the same engine that was, iirc, in serious need of a rebuild?

The last last time you mentioned anything specific about it's condition a few weeks back, wasn't it pretty seriously worn out well below minimum specs, and maybe even had a significant imbalance due to at least one probable valve issue? :dunno

And if it still is in that kind of shape, how is it you're not accounting for that in your evaluation of your car's performance (or lack thereof)?

A G10 that's lucky to make even 30 hp and only then when revved up to 5,000 rpm or higher would have more to do with poor performance than some hooey about weight. Especially when you consider people with the same vehicle weight as you (heavier Metros, a couple of passengers or more) and a tire diameter/final drive combination just as high as yours or even higher start up steep hill every day without 'killing the clutch."

There's just nothing all that special or extreme about your driving conditions.

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Cardinal Grammeter
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Sounds like you live in Ohio. If you ever get into WV or PA, its a completely different landscape. In fact, in Pittsburgh is the steepest paved road in the world, Canton Ave, a 37% grade. Of course not all hills in SW PA are 37%, but a 10% grade is nothing around here. Check out Pittsburgh Hills

Some people ride the clutch when they pull out. When my clutch engages, the engine is actually below idle - in other words, I slip the clutch the absolute minimum.

Now I can drive like other people and think everything is all Unicorns, but that is not me.

And it is totally off the table to raise the CG with bigger tires. I'm after handling and even with F&R sway bars, the 91 needs more bar. If I go to bigger, taller tires, there will be more grip and more roll because I just raised the CG.

Even if I had a G13B, my query would be the same.

Just so we're on the same page, if I could buy wider, shorter tires, I would. You just don't take the 10's off a Mini Cooper S if you know what I mean.
Edited by Cardinal Grammeter, Aug 9 2015, 05:04 PM.
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myredvert
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myredvert

All of this "my high weight and the steep hills of PA is the cause of my poor performance" hooey makes no sense in the context of a normally operating G10 combined with the relatively unremarkable tire diameter/final drive combination and vehicle weights being discussed.

Has anything changed with respect to the condition your engine in the several weeks since you said...
Quote:
 
My 125, 125, 85 compression G10...
:dunno

I could understand if you had said "considering the extremely poor condition of my engine I can't use anything but the smaller of the two spec diameters because I regularly carry passengers and have a lot of hills... That would actually make sense. :thumb

Personally, I would suggest before you try to determine what tire diameter you should have or not have you should consider trying to get your engine back to normal operating condition.
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Dattman
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I've used the yokohama A352? in 175/60/13 on a mk1 G10, great tire, the smaller OD and lighter weight really improves pickup, car was much nicer to drive, in stop start traffic it improved economy as well.
Should fit on a 4.5" rim but would be much nicer on some 13x5.5" alloys.
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Cardinal Grammeter
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Dattman, good point about weight - another factor for smaller tires/wheels. What rims did you use, the stock 4.5's?

I haven't done the research to find nice, wide 13's for the Metro.

Note on aspect ratio: I had a 87 Tbird Turbo coup that had 225/60r16's. When I bot it, they had 225/50r16's on it. It handled very nicely and was very responsive turning into corners. Switching to the 60 series killed responsiveness and now the car had no trace of "sports car" in it.
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Dattman
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Every one lb of rotating weight is the same as two off the car.
Tire OD makes a big difference, a 175/60/13 with a 3.79 diff is almost identical to 175/70/13 with a 4.1 in terms of rpm vs mph, however the car running the smaller lighter wheels will accelerate and stop better and therefore give better mileage in stop start traffic and hilly areas.
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