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1999 Geo Metro 1.0L engine replacement; What year engines will work for replacement
Topic Started: Feb 8 2018, 11:27 PM (4,396 Views)
Eagle
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Hello all ...
I have searched but one needs to know and use the right words to find things.
I'll ask and hope someone has a quick answer.

I have a 1999 Geo Metro car with the 1.0L engine that is tired (290K).
1.0L (VIN 6, 8th digit)
It has very low compression, right at 105 across all 3 cylinders.
I cannot get it to run without missing at certain points of the rpm range.
I have replaced plugs, wires, cap, rotor, PCV, both O2 Sensors, and timed it numerous times.
Starts and runs OK, revs OK, but at say 40-50 mph under power, there is a vibration. Then at 55 mph or so, it settles down.
I have had the tires balanced. I have not checked the alignment yet.
I was planning to replace timing belt and distributor.
I was going to check the fuel filter, but it is in the tank. Really a pain to check that out.
Shop manual says that doesn't normally need servicing. Maybe it does?
However, at what point do I admit it is an old engine and might not be able to get it to run right?
I could spend a pile of $$$ trying to get it right.
I have found a decent replacement motor at decent miles for a good price.
However, it is a 1996 1.0L engine.
Will that motor work in the 1999 car? I'm sure it will bolt in OK.
Just don't know about the other details. Like computer, fuel system, electrical, etc.
I have the complete wiring harness and computer for the 1996 donor motor.
Maybe I could use that if the 1996 wiring won't work. Would be a lot of work.
I have searched the web, but can't find anywhere that definitively states that I can do it.
I'm hoping that someone on the forum can advise me.
I'm really hoping that I can use that motor.
Any questions for me?

Thanks for checking in and listening.
Bob B-)
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cwatkin


ALL YEAR engines will work as a replacement. You will need to make sure you have oil pump from your old engine if you go earlier than 1996 becasue of the crank position sensor. You will need to swamp intake manifolds and throttle bodies, etc. Re-use your distributor. If you find an older model engine in great shape, go for it. You can swap it without much effort.

Of course the easiest is to find a 1999 engine in great shape and then nothing needs to be swapped!

Conor
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nickb803
NickB803

If you have the tools just rebuild it yourself. Or at least do the labor portion. Minimum compression is like 156 so if you're sitting at 105 it's time to rebuild it or swap.
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Eagle
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CWatkin ...
Thanks for the reply.
So, to make sure I understand, the 1996 1.0L engine will work for a replacement into the 1999 without changing anything, etc. Engines older than 1996 (1995 and earlier) will require the changes that you have noted.
I can find a 1999 for like $400 more than I can get the 1996 engine for. With my budget, that is a lot!
I thank you for your info.
NickB803 ...
In years past I would have rebuilt it (I have rebuilt engines in what seems like a previous life!)
Don't have the place to do it now. It would be fun.
Bob

Bob
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Metromightymouse
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Powdercoat Wizard

The long block of any G10 should work, before 96 there is no crank sensor so you have to use the oil pan and pump from your engine to do the swap. For any swap you basically strip down the motor and put all of your parts onto it. Anything with wiring or a sensor should be swapped. Check the timing set and if different, swap it as well.
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Woodie
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Eagle
Feb 9 2018, 12:30 AM
CWatkin ...
Thanks for the reply.
So, to make sure I understand, the 1996 1.0L engine will work for a replacement into the 1999 without changing anything, etc. Engines older than 1996 (1995 and earlier) will require the changes that you have noted.
Yes, 96 through 00 are identical mechanically. Might be some sensor differences, but if you leave the distributor, intake manifold and throttle body, and thermostat housing with the car and just change the engine itself, you'll be fine.
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geogonfa
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Just a note: :type
If you swap the engine in a '99 to a '96 and don't swap out the crank and cam gear with a new timing belt,
(note: the timing belt cover is also different),
make sure you mark down somewhere that you switched engines and state the year of the engine...
When it does become time to put a new timing belt on, the person installing it will get the right belt...
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Eagle
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Thanks guys for all the help.

Geogonfa
It sounds like I don't need to replace anything putting the '96 into the '99 Geo.
I will be doing pan and valve cover gasket as they are leaking a bit.
I had bought a timing belt for the '99 and was going to put that on the '96.
Are you saying the the timing belts are different? If so, I'll exchange.
And I will mark it down somewhere.
Thanks again ...
Bob
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freegeo
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Eagle
Feb 9 2018, 09:35 AM
Thanks guys for all the help.

Geogonfa
It sounds like I don't need to replace anything putting the '96 into the '99 Geo.
I will be doing pan and valve cover gasket as they are leaking a bit.
I had bought a timing belt for the '99 and was going to put that on the '96.
Are you saying the the timing belts are different? If so, I'll exchange.
And I will mark it down somewhere.
Thanks again ...
Bob
Quote:
 
Are you saying the the timing belts are different? If so, I'll exchange.


The 96, if it is original, will be the same as the 99. Timing belts, gear sets and timing belt cover are different on 95 and older. What goegonfa said makes sense though. If you would of put a older engine in and left the timing belts and gears on, it is a good idea to let the next owner know that. Saves them time and aggravation of getting the wrong parts.
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Eagle
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OK, I'm going to get the motor and get going on it.
Thanks again for the help.
Bob

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freegeo
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Let us know how it turns out or if you have any issues.
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Woodie
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geogonfa
Feb 9 2018, 07:57 AM
If you swap the engine in a '99 to a '96 and don't swap out the crank and cam gear with a new timing belt,
(note: the timing belt cover is also different),
Starting in '96 the timing belt went to 1" and remained that way throughout. I've heard mention of lifters and rings being different for 99 and 00, not sure about that, but he wouldn't need to care for purposes of the swap.

Yes it is a very good idea to document the swap in case someone needs to go inside the engine at a later date.


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freegeo
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Woodie
Feb 10 2018, 07:22 AM
geogonfa
Feb 9 2018, 07:57 AM
If you swap the engine in a '99 to a '96 and don't swap out the crank and cam gear with a new timing belt,
(note: the timing belt cover is also different),
Starting in '96 the timing belt went to 1" and remained that way throughout. I've heard mention of lifters and rings being different for 99 and 00, not sure about that, but he wouldn't need to care for purposes of the swap.

Yes it is a very good idea to document the swap in case someone needs to go inside the engine at a later date.


Quote:
 
I've heard mention of lifters and rings being different for 99 and 00, not sure about that


Thanks for that reminder Woodie, I do remember the ring thickness was different. Can't remember the exact year the change occured.
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Eagle
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OK, so I'm back ...
I want to thank those who responded to me and given me your thoughts.

I have a bit of a dilemma now ...
I bought the '96 engine off of Craigslist. A little over 100K, but a far cry from the 290K on my '99. I got it for $200. I knew it was a gamble, but I think I lost. The guy said it started and ran well. It was not in the car, so I couldn't do a compression test. I know, probably a mistake.

Bear with my narrative and read until the end ...
I started taking out the '99 today to start the swap with '96. Somewhere along the way, I started noticing too many differences. I was under the impression that the '96 engine would fit in for a swap. I'm guessing that it might mean that the block and motor mounts might fit, but there are major differences in the carburetor. The '99 has quite a bit more stuff on it. The water tube from the pump to radiator is different. There is no crankshaft sensor on the front bottom of the '96 like there is on the '99 (behind the front pulley). I know that is very important for the motor to run. If not there on the '96. how could I make it run in my '99 car?
I had not pulled the motor yet, but it was pretty much disconnected.
I am inquiring a little more as to what I could/should do. At this point, I think I am going to eat the $200 (maybe try and sell it back on Craigslist) and start looking for '99 engine for a swap. Or have someone rebuild my old one.
I have come to accept that it might have been a mistake.

Note :::::::
I just went back and read over the responses that I got on this forum post.

CWatkin said this in his post.
My bad. I missed the part about completely swapping out the manifold and throttle body.
I was thinking that I wouldn't have to do that. My mistake for not paying attention.
What about the crank sensor. Does this require my '99 oil pump and pan? Does just putting that on the '96 block solve that problem?
It sounds like I basically have to replace everything from the '99 to the '96 engine.
I'm beginning to think that this is more trouble than I want to deal with.

I was told this was '96 motor. Is there some way that I can verify it by something on the motor. Serial numbers, etc?
I'm just wondering if it could be '95. No crank sensor.

I'll sleep on this and tomorrow will be a new day.
And better, I hope!
Thanks for listening.
Bob

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suzukitom
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Tom

if you are retaining the 99 electrical system harness, yes you will need to swap the oil pan and crank sensor over to the 96 engine. (no oil pan gasket should be
used)

if you can do a compression test on the 96 engine, it would be good to do this before investing the time and effort swapping things out.

and it's possible that the '1996' engine is actually 1995, or the P.O. modded it to use an older oil pan.

somewhere on this site is a date code reference showing which block stamping letter stands for what year engine.

Edited by suzukitom, Feb 13 2018, 12:17 AM.
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